Gun Over Cycles
 

So i recently picked up a G&G GR16 R4 as a backup gun. I decided to clean out and regrease the mechbox, as I do with all my guns. This is my third V2 mechbox gun I own so I'm quite familiar with them.

So i opened it up, added a rubber spacer to the cylinmder head to correct AoE, shaved the first piston tooth, regreased everything with some silicone oil and put back together.

When I shoot in semi, it completes the cycle, but then continues into another partial cycle. The gears still sound like they spin abit, which I know they do because during that partial cycle, the loading nozzle nozzle moves forward.

On a side note, I also stripped one of the allen key screws on the mechbox, and one of the pistol grip screws broke... cheap metal

Im assumiung Ill have to drill these out, re tap the holes and find different screws?

If you're lucky enought thereis sometimes 4 holes for the pistol grip, so you might just have to switch holes. For the over cycling, had a similar issue when I changed to a JG M-93 motor, that motor was really powerful and it would be able to overcycle the gearbox... Solved the issue with an ASCU mosfet at that time...

I havent changed motor or battery though. Could it be part of the the whole trigger/ electrical system?

I didn't touch any of that and it looked the same when it went back together iirc, but could be a possibility

I have that problem and it turned out my anti reverse latch was broken

Hmm I don't think mines broken, I looked at it but maybe I installed wrong

When I fire in semi, the loading nozzle moves back and forth twice, stopping 1/4 back

If the anti-reversal latch would be broken and not working the piston would be slammed back at the zero position, the anti-reversal not holding the gears in place... It could be due to the trigger unit however, if the "slider" gets held in forward position more than it should it might be due to that too... In either ways, a MOSFET would probably solve your problem easily, if you plan of having it for a long time it's definitely worth it.

At this time there is some interesting threads about MOSFET around the forum, you should check it out if you want to go that way.

If the anti-reversal latch is broken, the gears would make a REALLY distinguishable and weird noise.
If you have cycle overlap, it's totally normal for most AEG's, and the easiest way to solve it is to buy a motor with stronger magnets. That will make the cycling stop faster in semi.
Cycle overlap can't be caused by the trigger unit, because the trigger unit is disabled by the cutoff lever in semi auto fire.

Getting an SW-COMP is total overkill for such a simple problem

Is the cutoff lever right below the sector gear?
I noticed my tappet plate seems kinda loose, and since it relates directly to the trigger system I might start there. I gotta figure out how to get this one stripped allen screw out first tho...

thunder when my anti reverse latch went it sounded normal. The only reason I found out it was broken is it would shoot 2 bbs every shot and when I started trouble shooting found out my anti reverse latch broke on one side.

That's not how the anti reversal latch works lol
What you just stated is that your car drives faster because your parking brake is broken.
It doesn't affect when your AEG stops shooting, it's SOLE purpose in the mechbox is to prevent the gears from reversing.
The tappet plate has nothing to do with cycle overlap either

Easy way to determine what your problem is, fire semi auto in quick succession. If the anti-reversal is broken, you'll strip the piston. If it's cycle overlap, it won't hurt the mechbox.
Easiest way to stop cycle overlap is with a motor with stronger magnets

Most likely you either had tight shimming and now you don't, greasing the gears made them spin more freely, or the motor height was too high to begin with.

What was happening with mine was overspin and then reversing to cause the double feed and I know why the latch failed I did not shim the latch to match the gear so it sideloaded and broke

So your sayin by simply regreasing the gears with a better grease and better shimming could cause this problem?

Assuming your gears were poorly shimmed before, then yes.
Buy a motor with neo magnets, problem solved.

And sorry ozzy, I though you meant it was firing two semi auto shots, seeing as the context here is cycle overlap.
cycle overlap is when your gun completes another partial forward cycle after the piston has been released. It's caused by too much momentum or not enough resistance in the system. Either having a weak-magnet motor, or very heavy gears, or simply by having a 9.6v or large battery.
Your problem was the cycle reversing after you had fired a shot, totally different problem.

So I reshimmed the gearbox, added a few to tighten things up a little. There was also a small spring above the trigger contacts that I fixed as it wasn't seated properly.

The gun still seems to me like it is cycling funny, but when I put the upper back on and tried shooting, it functioned just fine lol

I'll leave it like that for now

It should NOT be tigh...

You are basically killing the gears, motor and bushings, possibly wires and trigger too.

I also think that it was the ARL that was not set properly. It should push against the bevel gear, not away.

I checked again, the arl is in good shape and installed correctly. It's not too tight, just added a shim to get rid of any play

On second thought, maybe my cut off lever or nub on the sector gear may be slightly worn down, and replacing either or both would fix the issue

Its either the cut-off lever (cracked or broken), or you shimmed the sector gear too high. It could be your trigger system.... but i highly doubt it. Inspect the cut-off lever for and slight cracks or breaks. If its not broken double check check and make sure the sector gear isnt too high.

If this problem persists get a sector chip. You can get them for cents. Alot cheaper than a motor or MOSPHET....

Well the cut off lever looks okay, so Ill start with replacing the sector gear and reshimming it.

Do you mean sector gear delayers? If so I have some ordered and on the way already

sector clips only help with feeding issues due to very high rates of fire, they don't do anything for overcycling.
no such thing as a sector gear delayer

Yes and no. I have used them with lots of success when dealing with over-spin while using 7.4v lippo's, and works great. It will give the extra bit of friction needed to stop the gears (wont work using 11.1v). Using a sector clip WILL help with this over-spin especially because the gun is only over-cycling 1/4 cycle too much.
The overspin is probably because of a worn tappet plate, and a sector clip is cheaper than a tappet plate, which is why i suggested the clip over anything else.

What? You're going to have to elaborate on that one a bit for me, don't see it

That's not how you should be solving gun problems lol
The last thing you want to do is ADD friction to your setup.
If you're driving in the city, and your doing 65, it would be like keeping your foot on the gas at 65, and applying constant pressure on your brakes to reduce your speed to 60. You just don't do it.

I'm telling you, just upgrade your motor to one with stronger magnets, then it only adds resistance to the system when there is no power to the motor. Like braking AFTER you take your foot off the gas.

Very good analogy Frank. I didn't know how to reply without sounding like a douche

I'm getting really good at snarkist-analogism :)

LOL. then y is it recommended for high speed setups? It only adds friction to the cycle at the point where you need it (when its trying to stop) . The gun is ever cycling because of too much inertia. By adding a sector clip it will add stopping power because the sector gear and sector chip is in contact with the tappet plate for longer, adding more surface area. ITs not like its rubbing on gears or the side of the mech box... Its only coming into contact with the tappet plate (like its needs too).

Changing the motor is like changing the engine in your car when nothing is wrong with the engine.... Why not fix what the actual problem is.... and over-spin problem. And there is several ways to do this. A .50 cent plastic chip is more reasonable than a whole motor, and isnt replacing parts that is still good and nothing wrong with it (motor). There is no need to EVER replace a motor unless it is fried.

A sector chip does interact with the fin of the tapper plate longer than a smaller diameter post would...and in effect prolongs the portion of the firing cycle where the nozzle is retracted. The sole purpose of the nozzle being retracted is to allow a bb to feed up from a mag.

In high speed setups it's very possible for the nozzle to retract and return forward faster than the spring force of the mag can slip a bb into the feed path...so you'll get blanks.

By retracting the nozzle a bit earlier and letting it go forward a little later in the cycle enough time is created for a bb to get into the feed path

^That
Why fix what ain't broken? You don't have a feeding problem, so why use a solution that fixes a problem you don't have?
And it's not going to add enough friction to stop the gun from over cycling anyway, it doesn't add that much friction. I'm just saying you're looking at solving this problem the wrong way.

And there IS something wrong with the motor. The magnets aren't strong enough, and that's WHY it's over cycling.
Getting an SW-COMP with active braking will cost more than a new motor, and it'll just toast the current motor. You need a good motor to run an SW-COMP anyway.
Take the motor out of your gun, and spin it with your fingers, if it continues to spin, it has no stopping power. If you have trouble even turning it in the first place, it's a powerful motor AND it'll prevent over cycling.

I'm telling you, upgrading the motor will solve the problem 110%

A new motor prolly would fix the problem, just trying to eliminate any other possibilities. The gun never fired this way when I first got it, which is why I thought it was something I did inside the gearbox.

I'll update with new sector gear