Replicas siezed in York Region
 

http://www.680news.com/news/local/ar...28_130509_2876

Anyone know anything?

Three people, Markham business ... now I wonder who could it be? *coughKur*coughame*cough

There's your future of airsoft right there.

You heard it here first!

WTF? How exactly can these stores be raided if these things arn't being imported and sold illegally? Is it simply because the cops class all airsoft guns as replica firearms?

Guess not

Aww geeze man.. I hate reading and seeing shit like this. Really not trying to put the Markham/R-Hill area down but I've met more people in that area that are more irresponsible then anywhere else. I know, I'm not looking at the huge grand scale but... bah.

The sky is falling! rofl

Ahhhhhhhhhh!!:o

Oh NoEs!1!1!!BBQeleven

http://www.police.york.on.ca/Press/[2007-02-28]%20GUNS%20AND%20GANGS%20INTELLIGENCE%20UNIT%20SEIZ ES%2060%20REPLICA%20FIREARMS%20IN%20MARKHAM.pdf

they where from a store in Pacific Mall.

copy and pasted link, didn't seem to work.

go to this
http://www.police.york.on.ca/media.asp

its the first post

Anyone have a spidey sense about what prompted these raids?

look what task force laid charges...

"Great work by officers working out of the York Regional Police #5 District Headquarters and the Guns and Gangs Intelligence Unit, in partnership with the Provincial Weapons Enforcement Unit and investigators from
the Canada Border Services Agency, has resulted in the seizure of 60 replica firearms from a retail store and two residences in the Town of Markham."

Hmm, interesting charges:

-Possession of a Prohibited Device
-Unauthorized Transfer of a Prohibited Device
-Import Unauthorized Prohibited Device

Anyone know the guys charged (their names are on the PDF)


Tempting to visit the press showing tomorrow ;-)

So they possed them, imported them without the right license, and sold them... Well at least they aren't going after individual players.

Canada Border agency................

Maybe just blowing needless smoke out my butt but I wonder if cops are using airsoft to show that they are showing their communities that they are busting "crime" and airsoft guns because they look so real they can provide the public the "impression" they are cracking down. Then again, maybe its just me...

Let's hope not.

Interesting? News flash: the law says airsoft guns are replicas. Replicas are prohibited devices.

Any where did I say they were not? I said INTERESTING....

Go be a troll in another thread and stop trying to start the "airsoft is legal/illegal argument" in yet another thread. There are already enough discussions about that.

Saw the same newsflash on CP24.

No the sky has already fallen.

I can name 3 places to get airsoft guns in Canada now. And not a very good selection at that.

Time to get your heads out of the sand so you can see the end come.

Wow, this is some news to me... esp. as I am just getting back into the sport/community after being away since 2003/4.

I doubt the sky has fallen... same could be said about Y2K which was a much bigger issue and look at what happened with that - NOTHING.

Rule of the day: Be irresponsible, Get the cuffs!

There definately needs to be some sort of open-forum held with the community and their local political representatives - no joke. Back when I played (for a bit) the main concern was youngersters buying and shooting these things randomly and in inappropriate locations... now ASC has this age verification policy down pat which looks great and seems to be working.

Maybe the next step is to have all those who want to purchase airsoft aegs/gbbs to have a PAL / ATT - firearms training courses (mandatory) in order to apply for a firearm licence. Sure it may suck to spend $80+ but if it keeps the boys in blue away and makes the political community feel assured that things are done correctly for the sport then maybe it might be the best policy thus far?

Please share your thoughts...

Furthermore, maybe ASC should have a paid membership (small fee of $25) with files on record as to address, etc. and which aegs are owned.

Just my two cents.

Cheers,
KaOz.

We know it's happening... you're just supposed to keep it quiet.

God save Canadians from yet another registry. The last time I bought a real gun, my name ended up in the CFC database, which the Ottawa Citizen promptly has published in a searchable format by the first two postal code digits. All you are doing is registering yourself for a future seizure. Without property rights embedded in our constitution, the government can seize and take anything from you without compensation. Real gun owners have been dealing with this for the last 30 years in progressive waves of registration and restriction. It does not get you anywhere.

Hello,

I understand where you are coming from and unfortunately, in Canada there isn't a power-house as strong as the NRA as there is here in the US.

Okay, taking your point... but what alternative or suggestion(s) do you have then?

What I am trying to do here is "cut to the chase" with these posts... too many people write sob stories about the sky falling while others have an angry tiff with the government - what choices do we have as a community? What steps must we take to make sure our sport stays alive and we don't get personal seizures or arrests? Who or whom do we need to speak to regarding this?

Cheers,
KaOz.

that link just closed my browser twice in as row(well netscape... didnt tried with IE yet)

Eeeww... netscape/IE... FIREFOX baby! Yeah!

Full text, even where to go to see the stuff seized and the trial. Is anyone local curious enough?
4300 Steeles is Pacific Mall, so it's not rocket science to figure out the rest.



GUNS AND GANGS INTELLIGENCE UNIT SEIZES 60 REPLICA FIREARMS IN MARKHAM

Great work by officers working out of the York Regional Police #5 District Headquarters and the Guns and Gangs Intelligence Unit, in partnership with the Provincial Weapons Enforcement Unit and investigators from the Canada Border Services Agency, has resulted in the seizure of 60 replica firearms from a retail store and two residences in the Town of Markham.

During the afternoon of Thursday, February 22, 2007, and into the early morning hours of Friday, February 23, 2007, investigators executed Criminal Code search warrants at two residences located on Prince Regent Street and Frisby Court and at a business located at 4300 Steeles Avenue East. The warrants were sought after information gained in an investigation revealed that replica firearms defined as prohibited devices by the Criminal Code, were being imported, possessed and sold at a Markham business. As a result, officers seized the 60 replica firearms including a variety of handguns and rifles of various makes and models.

CHARGED: Kwok Cheung PONG, 32, of Markham;� Kelvin CHEUNG, 29, of Markham; Yui Chung KWOK, 27, of Richmond Hill; CHARGES INCLUDE: Possession of a Prohibited Device, Unauthorized Transfer of a Prohibited Device, Import Unauthorized Prohibited Device.

All three accused have been released from custody and are scheduled to appear before the Ontario Court of Justice in Newmarket on March 30, 2007.

The Criminal Code of Canada defines a prohibited device as “any component or part of a weapon, or any accessory for use with a weapon, that is prescribed to be a prohibited device, a handgun barrel that is equal to or less than 105 mm in length, but does not include any such handgun barrel that is prescribed, where the handgun barrel is for use in international sporting competitions governed by the rules of the International Shooting Union, a device or contrivance designed or intended to muffle or stop the sound or report of a firearm, a cartridge magazine that is prescribed to be a prohibited device or a replica firearm.”

Members of the York Regional Police Guns and Gangs Intelligence Unit will be available to update media on the investigation and provide a display of the seized replica firearms at a press conference Thursday, March 1, 2007, at 2:30 p.m. at the #5 District Headquarters, located at 8700 McCowan Road in
the Town of Markham.

Anyone with information is asked to contact the York Regional Police Guns and Gangs Intelligence Unit at 1-866-876-5423, ext. 7847, Crime Stoppers at 1-800-222-TIPS

The problem here are the fucking idiot punks, not airsoft. Why can't those in authority SEE that?

This upsets me to no goddamn end!

found out its the lycos search popup that open when you get in the site that crashed netscape, IE works fine and Firefox is just an advanced version of netscape made by the same compagny.

3 guys importing without liscence ( on purpose to sell ) is more likely the reason. In this case , they were selling on the black market.

The problem here is 3 guys who had a STORE and did not follow the laws.

(Oh, right, they'd never get caught either because nobody saw them... my bad)

First of all we all continue to behave and promote safe and responsible play, as we always have as a community. Second, we assess where this is going, with input from people who know what is going on. If the government is committed to a new course of action on this, or is indeed, just enforcing import rules, we need to know that. Lastly we have to discuss (calmly) the long term implications for us as players, if indeed this is a crackdown that will affect our access to a supply of airsoft guns, and what it means for new players coming into the sport trying to find airsoft guns to play with. At the moment there is not enough information to really assess what is happening to react yet.

But I do know a registry won't assuage CBSA and won't change the law that is currently on the books. Thats the problem with occupying a grey area in law - some people will see more white than black and others will see more black than white. And if you push too hard, you end up with a solid color you never wanted to see.

Why? Kimver Gill was one psyhco with a Glock, a Storm and shotty. He killed 1 person in a school. Now, the Fiberals have instituted a ban on semi-autos as a party platform item. One guy with legal guns. Marc Lepine brought about the last Firearms Act with it's Draconian restrictions. One man with a Mini-14.

What makes you think that 1 kid who gets shot by a cop because he had a KSC Glock would not lead to an immediate ban on all replicas for everyone. It has happened in the past. IT WILL HAPPEN AGAIN!!!

Those in authority believe the public at large will accept results, any results. As long as any gun is taken off the streets, they see victory.

Hello,

I am considering calling the telephone number and requesting to speak with someone of authority there - it would be at least a nice editorial piece for Airsoft Xtreme Magazine (which I plan on being a contributor now).

I want to share "our side" of the story and discuss things.

Your thoughts on this?

Feel free to post questions that you think I should ask - I plan on limiting them to 10 maximum. I do not want to step on anyone's toes, so this is why I am asking ahead of time - no surprises.

If people on this forum feel that I should not mention ASC at all... or that we play, etc. please state so.

Unfortunately, I will not be back in Tdot until the end of March so I am not able to attend the Press Conference.

Cheers,
KaOz.

Do we wait until the axe has fallen to assess whether the axe has indeed fallen? Or do we look to see that an axe may fall and act to avoid it?

That is the basic question. Apathy is worse than the axe itself.

The people named in the charges are not the same person operating the link you posted. It is not him.

I know, the urge to do something and the need to do it is apparent, but, if you don't have a plan with a set of goals all you create is friction and heat and no traction.

I think the press conference that will be held tomorrow may give us some insight as to what led police to make this raid and what authority and legal grounds they're citing for it. Once we know that, we'll have an idea from what side we've been swiped here and can react to it. Right now there is simply nothing we can do but watch.

go ahead, but dont say any names or site adresses.

Can someone please keep me posted on this - i.e. press conference as I am here in Boston and would not be able to get any information from it at all - thank you in advance.

You make a very good point and we shall wait and see.

Back to my questions re: editorial piece + questions for the authority figures regarding airsoft and well, what is to happen... please post or PM me. Thank you.

Cheers,
KaOz.

A member of our local forum has already been in contact with the NRA. We hoping this will lead to an ally in a fight who's used to fighting the Feds on these very issues.

You'll have to excuse me, but some of us are not really willing any longer to sit by and watch all unfold like a deer caught in the headlights. The end of airsoft may not be now, but it's not as far away as all the ostriches think it is.

And yes, it is a big deal when the founders of a national forum are shut down.

Go ahead and call but the cops will just give the same old song and dance that they can't tell the difference between a replica and a real gun...hence they should all be taken off the streets.

The bloody idiots will just not get it through their heads... if someone is brandishing a weapon in public, especially while committing or attempting to commit a crime, they deserve the maximum response from the law.

The cop should not be trying to determine if it's real or not. Assume it's real. There is no difference. They just became a criminal for gods sakes, don't be nice!

If an "innocent kid" is waving a toy gun in public, he's obviously not innocent and needs to learn a life lesson really quickly courtesy of the ETF!

But as per usual, punish the majority for one persons mistake.

Ah will it ever end, next we'll be banning knives like they are trying to do in the UK.

Noted.

I will never disclose any names nor any of the retailers, etc. Keep in mind that I too am part of the community and would never want to cause harm to anyone or anything.

I will also not state ASC or the website - I will speak in general terms as in an "Airsoft Group" - leaving out the term community... so as to not hint at anything. Mind you, police intelligence might have already caught on and could be watching... so post carefully, at least for the moment. It is not too difficult to google airsoft + canada and viola.

Cheers,
KaOz.

I'm a member of the NRA, the NFA and the CSSA, and I can tell you right now, you're not going to get support from any of them them. We've solicited the NRA for help in Canada for real firearms and while we have their moral support, they don't see a mandate to push their agenda in another country that only has a handful of paying members in it like myself. Are you a paid member of any of those organizations? Why should they defend your property rights regarding replica/imitation firearms?

You can try the NFA (Canadian version) but they are doing all they can just to hang on to Canadian firearms owners rights, they're probably not going to spend much time or resources defending replica firearms, and some circles in the firearms community would agree about banning airsoft guns - so I don't think thats a productive direction either.

Ultimately the response will have to come from this community. There are members here that have been engaged in a dialog with the government on and off for some time. So like I said, I am waiting for more information (24-72 hour timeframe) before I say or do anything definitive.

The first part of journalism my friend is to know how to walk that tight rope... as to get one's message across without backing down on what point is trying to be made.

I will not be rude to anyone who I speak to and will not be speaking to any regular "police officier" - I want the head of the task force. If I have to track everyone down and ultimately talk to the top cop as they call it, I will.

As for the member who contacted the NRA - can that person please contact me ASAP! I need to know who and what was said.

Also, if someone could please email me the regulations as to airsoft ownage, etc. I need as much information as possible to gather an arguement/questions.

Seeing as no one is actually posting questions they would like answered in an intelligent fashion, I am left but to make them on my own.

Cheers,
KaOz.

Good point, an Admin may want to delete that post before those poor fools get a no-knock entry from the McCowan Road Good Humor Squad.

Okay, I am sorry to have to say this but can we please keep all this fakeness and humour aside? This to me is a very real and important issue that we as a community have to face head-on. For the remainder of this post, can we please not call the Police or anyone relating to this incident by slang terms or comical ones?

Thank you and apologies if I am voicing my anger,
KaOz.

GOOD POINTS... until tomorrow or the day after then. I shall leave it at that and worst case, will make my call on Monday morning after I have gathered the necessary information.

Again to stress this - it is a serious issue and if you are going to make a joke of it... please post somewhere else.

Thank you,
KaOz.

Your exposure to CF is beginning to show... ;) I'm bookmarking that one...

I'm not saying don't talk about it, I am just saying there is nothing to do, no action you can take, at this stage, but dialog and exchanging ideas are never a bad thing.

Well, I will leave the good dialogue and idea exchanges to you good men (and women?)... until tomorrow.

Cheers,
KaOz.

No problem at all, I appreciate honesty. Let us know if/how we can help.

Cheers

The fellow our local member spoke with was David Thomlinson (sp?) of the NFA. Even a small victory against the Firearms Act in any form by the NFA can only help their cause. I'm not a member, but many around where I live are.

i did meet one of them b4..i feel sorry for'em...i wonder if the store is closed down now..i think they knew it was coming...last time i went to buy some metal bushings they took all acessories down..hopefully everything works out..

Wow this suxs for the company

I hate when shit like this happens so close to home. I could walk to Pacific Mall in 5 minutes.
-VM

What happens to people who bought guns from them I wonder. Do they get it seized?

Did you buy one from them? :rolleyes:

Depending if you pay by cash or visa, it'll be much harder to track.

No i havent bought from them I just joined their war gamer club. But it suxs for me since i do have airsoft at home.

i feel really bad for the store owners :(

I can only name 2. A&A and buyairsoft. ASCArmoury is dead now.
Unless you're thinking of a different place, or posted before the announcement?

aimazon.ca

You'll all hate me forever for this, but after lurking and reading all sides of this topic... it might be a good idea to sell off and settle for MilSim with Paintball guns.

ascarmoury is not dead. they just no longer sell replicas (except for the ones on crazy sale right now).

I'll take in all your airsoft free of charge!

Warcraft Games
http://www.warcraftgames.ca/airsoft.html

Yea, there are 3. Unfortunetly ASCA had by far the best prices. Heck most of the guns on A&A are easily $100 more expensive than ASCA. I'm not sure about the prices on warcraftgames, I haven't done a comparison of them yet.

Is Warcraftgames reputable? I need someone to help fulfill my never-ending hunt for China guns lmao

Just to keep you all informed and not to burst your aeg-shopping-bubble, but we have an issue at hand.

Please see link - thank you.

http://www.airsoftcanada.com/showthread.php?t=35397

Cheers,
KaOz.

Nothing "interesting" about those charges whatsoever unless you're an ignorant fool. I suppose you also found it "interesting" that Robert Pickton was charged with murder? :rolleyes:

Troll, indeed.

I've been in contact with one of the guys there about a gun.. they're quick to reply, seem professional. I believe some other members of the forum have ordered guns and other equipment from them in the past. They just recently started internet ordering. I don't think they stock china guns though. They have TM, CA, ICS, etc.

Like all my other posts in thew last day i say RALLY !

Well the facts are if you break laws you are bound to get shut down and charged.

Without the import permits, you are importing illegally. This makes us all look bad.

I think they DO have the permits, but seeing how strict all the laws have become lately and I'm sure the governments been giving everyone hell, might be a reason why ASCA is stopping the order of all guns. My guess is that Kuramae probably went oh screw the government we have the licenses, than the government uses their power to manipulate blah blah blah u'know especially with there being no clear cut laws about airsoft etc etc... you get the picture.

Who gives a shit about Kuramae. The guy was a dick head anyways.
Yay! He just fucked himself in the ass and now ruined the rep on airsoft...
I knew something bad would happen to him one day or another, he was always talking trash and over pricing guns.
You guys remember this post?
http://airsoftcanada.com/showthread....hlight=kuramae
My rant about his shifty attitiude.

Trixta I rememeber you told me that you were close friends with that guy!

I wasn't close, I never said I was close friends with them, if I was I would never need to buy off of Raygis or BCAirsoftSupply or BuyAirsoft.ca. I knew Kelvin decently well, we'd chat occasionaly when I'd stop by the store but that was about it. I'm sure they had the licenses cause they've been selling airsoft for years, like come on, the majority of crimes committed with firearms here in Toronto are with BB guns and Pellet guns of all sorts, so even if they DID have the licenses the government would obviously pressure them to stop doing it, but it's their choice right? They probably went oh well with that I'm paying for licenses why not ... and the government like customs seeing that there are no clear cut laws can do what they want, or what they think is right.

I don't know if any of you has noticed but the cops have now taken more replica fire arms off the streets in the past six months than they have taken real fire arms. They need to be seen as doing something.

guys it is what it is. I hope to see all of you at the nearest game when the weather clears. Airsoft forever

Notice how it was the ghang unit too there ovesly trying to show that there not afraid of geting into seizing the wepons ovisly there either showing them like real guns (whith out the orange tip) or the cops are bums

Dude, you either need to lay off the pot or do some growing up. This issue is more complex than you can understand.

If they had permits to import.. they would not be charged with import offenses...

The wind is blowing in a new direction.. at least for now..

These guys got busted for importing and trafficing in prohibited devices.
They have been charged.. this is a reality.

The police clearly have the will and intent to enforce the law against the trafficing in prohibited devices.. and in this case they deemed airsoft guns to be replicas...

It is no longer a "western Canada issue" or a Quebec Issue... it is a canada wide change in the direction of enforcment with respect to replica firearms.

They are going after the sources...First the unlicensed importers.. the ones flaunting the abuse of the law.
Maybe it will stop there... maybe it won't

A prudent man would cease trade until the new landscape emerges from the fog

Yea, I guess it takes less effort to do something about illegally imported relicas than illegally imported firearms.

Is it not possible that they did hold the correct permits, but their intent to traffic voided the permit, causing it to be unlawful importation? I don't recall the exact wording, but my understanding was that the importation required there to be intent to use them lawfully?

Yes so far, as it pertains to retailers. A troubling development no less, but there isn't evidence to suggest individual players are at risk... yet...

From my understanding this is about importing and reselling outside the terms of the import licenses that they may or may not have had. Whether this means a crack down on airsoft in general or just as it relates to players remains to be seen. There has been no formal warning of a crackdown of any kind but ASCA is doing the prudent thing and ceasing sales of airsoft guns. Incidently the bust at Pac Mall was just coincidence - ASCA had made that decision prior to that bust, it was just a sort of 'icing on the cake/last straw' thing.

After speaking with Hojo today, what is clear to me is that the current set of laws as they stand don't support the sale of airsoft in Canada. As far as ownership goes, there hasn't been a case on record that we know of where someone was charged without first having done something to warrant it (as an individual) and that the law has been in place for the last 9 years to do so. The December 1, 1998 grandfather date was put in place with the import controls in the hopes that the supply would choke off and that there would be no need to pursue individuals owning guns. Those publically transacting with AEGs after December 1998, specifically those SELLING them are putting themselves at risk, and those violating the terms of their import licenses are for all intents and purposes are breaking the law. As for the buyer, it is a lot less clear. An airsoft gun is only a "replica" if the law deems it as such and that designation is debatable and has yet to be directly tested in a court as it pertains to an individual player. The way the laws are written makes it simply unclear, which is why I think the retailers are the easiest targets to go after.

For those arguing the whole in-out of the closet on airsoft, it is my feeling that its time to pursue the acknowledged and legal ownership of replicas, because as it stands, it looks like airsoft is slowly becoming recognized as 'replica' in the eyes of the law.

The only risk in doing this is that if it goes against us, they could write laws that do the opposite and make us all criminals overnight. The firearms community has experienced this first hand, so don't dismiss it as unlikely.

I'm not exactly sure where to take it from here. Events that have taken place yesterday and in the past months were put in motion long before they happened, so there is a plan being executed against retailers of airsoft guns, there is no doubt. But it is still unclear where that leaves the community of hobbists that we are and whether they will ultimately pursue us individually. In speaking to some LE, there are no new orders at the street level regarding them. I suspect if there is a move afoot to come after individuals, we will see a change in how the individual officer is told how to handle airsoft gun encounters or whether to actively pursue them.

There are LE on this board and I am sure LE who play airsoft reading this. Keep your ears to the ground and if you see a change in the wind, let your friends know before something comes down the pipe. As much as I love airsoft, if I have to throw my AEG receiver into the woodchipper, I will.

Hojo seems to feel the PAL option and having a provision for replicas may be viable. I understand Greylocks has done some research and has found a sympathetic ear in the right place that might help with that - I dunno, he can address that. And that begets another thought I had - custom receivers that don't resemble real world gun receivers but that still look militaristic - is this a viable option?

Yes it is very possible that they had import licenses... but violated them by selling them to individuals.. Good point

It might make them technically legal for awhile but if the government set on getting rid of things that look real all it would take is a stroke of the pen. the other issue is we'd probably have to have them manufactured here as I doubt any airsoft company is going to start making generic military looking receivers just for our market. We'd probably be better of getting m-16 conversion kits for Tippman A-5s but if it comes to that the milsim community in the country will wither to nothing overnight.

Yea, I agree with trufret. Chances of getting someone to custom make recievers just for the Canadian market is pretty slim.

Go with PAL. But let's not lie to ourselves.. If the government wants to shut this sport down, they will. I don't like it, but there's not a whole lot we can do to prevent their iron fist from crushing our sport. Plus.. cops gotta prove the taxes are going to work! I mean.. ofcourse they'd rather raid someone with replicas as opposed to real steel.. it's just safer...:rolleyes:

Personally, I don't think anyone is "out to kill the sport", especially with clearsoft still being sold in retail chains; they're simply trying to enforce laws which are already on the books. The cops didn't make those laws, the Liberals did -- something to keep in mind next time you're at the ballot box, if you really are pissed off by what's going down.

But honestly, it doesn't really surprise me. Those of us who've been around long enough remember the late 90s, after C68 got passed, when the only retailers around were Tru, APEC and some other outfit I don't remember the name of (the guy's name was Leblanc I think...). Or used stuff on the [US-based] AirsoftZone dboard, if you could find a fellow Canadian selling stuff.

In the past few years, I've seen retailers multiply and prices drop considerably. If anything, post-C68 Canada seemed to have more airsoft flowing in than ever before. To help matters even more, we saw a huge rise in self-righteous newcomers who seemed to feel a constant urge to challenge the state of airsoft's legality, attempt to find new and clever ways to outsmart Customs to save a few dollars, and pull a few really bone-headed stunts to boot, insuring airsoft a big prominent spot on everyone's radar.

Everyone who joined up after 1998 knew straight-up airsoft was in grey area AT BEST; you knew the risks and you got in anyway and you even got your way for a while, but don't go and act all surprised and indignated now that it's turned around and threatened to bite you in the ass. Everyone who was here before you told you to lay low and not rock the boat, but apparently that's way too much to ask of some people.

PS. the PAL idea is great. I'm all for that.

Hmm, I bought my rifle from Kuramae and they were great. But the shop in pacific mall is just a front, all of the guns are kept in a warehouse, I'm guessing thats what the police raided. Would be quite a sight to see them bust through the doors of pacific mall, all geared up. Kelvin is a great guy and I wish him safe passage through any legal repercussions.

Now that airsoft is nearing extirpiration, would anyone like to buy my TM M14?

huh. a 15 year old with a TM M14 that lives in Berlin - that get's stuff at pacific mall? - something don't make sense here. -

Humm !

Fishy but we all know that store was selling to underaged !, and also that a town in ontario was named berlin in the past and the town name change a while ago.

So you have your answer !

Why people keep posting only to post, even if this is wrong ?

JF

lol it's quarter to nine in the morning, I have no work on my desk and little of nothing to do besides cruise here... read something 'fishy'- and felt compelled to question - never knew of a Berlin, Ont. Ya got me there (thanks).. - now this post is a post only to post... *must.stop.typing.* -

At the beginning of WWI, Berlin, On. was renamed Kitchener.

Just out of curiosity, and I'd like an honest answer, if legislation changes turning an previously legal object into an illegal one, is there generally a "grace" period where previous owners can turn these objects in without fear of legal persecution?

To answer, yes there is. Usually it is a set date from when the legislation was confirmed.

Take the smoking ban in Toronto for example with restaurants. They had x-number of months to (at first) revamp their air filtration and HVAC systems so that they could have a designated "smoking room" and at a later point, the full ban completely.

Cheers,
KaOz.

Last night CTV Toronto News at 23:30 show a one minute report on what the police had shown to the public at a news conference. Here is what I saw on display at a long table, TM Type 89, TM M-4, ICS AK, at least four MP-5s, an M-249 possible from CA, and a number of GBBs of different kinds.
My biggest concern or my bottom line is that will the sport of airsofting survive in this country?

For reference:

http://www.police.york.on.ca/Press/%...%20MARKHAM.pdf