High Speed Gears Stripping Pistons

[MaciekA]

Originally Posted by Bar1975

(still running the G&P M120)

This is a common issue on stronger springs paired with the G&P M120 motor, seemingly dependant on batch (I've seen some able to pull a bit more than others depending on how much power they're given).

Any neo motor will give you dramatically more torque than this thing.

[Bar1975]

Is there any difference between the two following SHS motors. Are they the exact same motor only titled differently depending on what store your looking at?

SHS High Torque
http://torontoairsoft.com/SHS-High-T...or_p_1343.html

SHS Ultra High Torque Motor
http://www.airsoftparts.ca/store2/in...roducts_id=452


Both are NEO motors i would assume?

I need the LONG version and it looks like toronto airsoft is the only place with one in stock right now. But if the Ultra High is a different/better motor (and cheaper at that??) then I'd hold out for airsoftparts to get one in stock

[lurkingknight]

when you check your shimming... are the halves of the gearbox screwed together?

How is the pinion to bevel engagement? it's possible to have good shimming of the gears, but if they don't shim properly to the pinion, you will get resistance, though it may not sound like it when you shoot it.

I'm turning into a lonex whore... I like their stuff and for the price difference a lonex motor is not that much more... an shs motor is just plain dirt cheap. Believe it or not, there's cheaper neo motors out there as well. All neo motors require a bit more juice, a 20C should be enough to pull an shs though.

[Bar1975]

Originally Posted by lurkingknight

an shs motor is just plain dirt cheap

Dirt cheap but crappy in terms of quality or just a great deal?

Is the Lonex version that much better to justify the extra $20?

[iKliiu]

SHS motors are awesome hand warmers for winter games. Performance wise, the Lonex is much more efficiency, but if money if an issue go with the SHS / clones.

[lurkingknight]

dirt cheap as in 35$ for a really powerful neo motor vs something like 80$ for a ferrous guarder extreme torque up motor that isn't as powerful?

Or a 55$ lonex that's better... but 20$ better? debatable in some circles.

IF you have room for a giantass battery, shs is no problem... if you are battery space limited that can only use something that's like 1200 mah lipo, then a lonex would work better. Just make sure you have high enough discharge in the battery to juice whatever the motor needs to pull... lower ratio gears and heavier spring make things heavier to pull for example.

[Bar1975]

Originally Posted by lurkingknight

IF you have room for a giantass battery, shs is no problem... if you are battery space limited that can only use something that's like 1200 mah lipo, then a lonex would work better. Just make sure you have high enough discharge in the battery to juice whatever the motor needs to pull... lower ratio gears and heavier spring make things heavier to pull for example.

well if you read through this thread you will see that battery space is the root of most of my issues. I'm running an Mp5K with virtually NO SPACE for a battery. I guess this means that the Lonex motor will be a better investment. At this point i really don't see a solution for the battery. Toronto airsoft has a Firefox Stick lipo that would probably fit but of course it's out of stock like most everything else that one would actually need. I've tried all kinds of tiny little 7.4 lipos and they don't come close to fitting this thing.

What would be the minimum lipo discharge rate to run this Lonex motor and pulling 13:1 High Speed Gears with a SP120 spring?

Also.. should i completely give up on the 9.6 NiMh battery that actually fits this gun? Would that battery ever be able to work in this set up? Seems like im forced to use a high discharge lipo here..

[lurkingknight]

there's a 9.6v stick you can get... it's the same 9.6v stick that fits in AK batteries.

Following that sizing theory, any AK lipo should fit in the mp5k.

[Bar1975]

I have a Firefox 9.6V NiMh battery all ready. It worked fine until i installed the high speed gears and sp120 spring.

It's because of this battery that i've started to look at higher torque motors and more powerful batteries.

Assuming everything was set up properly.. should the 9.6 pull this set up with no issues? Mixed responses here on this one.. a lot of people say it should but a lot are saying that the gears/spring/G&P M120 motor just need a better battery and possibly a higher torque motor

[Stealth]

This thread has gotten pretty long so I'm going to recap. Correct anything that is incorrect.

Madbull M120 Spring
G&P M120 motor
CA high torque ferrite motor
Lonex red piston
SHS 13:1 gearset

Battery:
GensAce 7.4v 20C 1200mah lipo
Firefox 9.6v 1200mah? NiMH
? 11.1v 15C ?mah lipo

Issue:
Gun does not cycle properly. Mechbox binds when using 7.4v and 9.6v battery. 11.1v works.

Things to do before throwing more money at the problem:
1. Re-shim your gears. Maciek wrote an awesome post in one of your threads. If in doubt, shim loose. You can always fine tune later. Make sure you screw the two halves of the mechbox together when testing.
2. Make sure the Lonex red piston teeth mesh properly with the sector gear. You can't just drop it in and assume it will work. The red piston has "skinnier" teeth due to the reinforced rails.
3. Check your batteries using a multimeter. A fully charged 7.4v lipo should read around 8v fully juiced. The 9.6v should read around 10.5v.
4. Since this is a V3, you can test everything without installing the mechbox into the gun. Test on your workbench first.

If all fails, then dump money into the motor.

[Stealth]

EDIT: Dammit John. Why are we replying to the same thread?

I hate to be a bringer of bad news, but if you're expecting crisp trigger response and something like 20+RPS with a 7.4V 20C ~1000mah battery then you'll be somewhat disappointed - the battery is small and you just can't beat physics like that. I'm running an old 7.4V 15C 1000mah battery with a 350fps spring and I'm right around 19rps - I think I can get it higher with bearing bushings but too lazy to put them in and reshim. :P

Yes you'll get better response with the a neo motor (Lonex OR SHS), but the fact remains you're pulling a 400fps spring with ultra high-speed gears - that setup draws a lot of amps on startup.

[lurkingknight]

Originally Posted by Bar1975

I have a Firefox 9.6V NiMh battery all ready. It worked fine until i installed the high speed gears and sp120 spring.

It's because of this battery that i've started to look at higher torque motors and more powerful batteries.

Assuming everything was set up properly.. should the 9.6 pull this set up with no issues? Mixed responses here on this one.. a lot of people say it should but a lot are saying that the gears/spring/G&P M120 motor just need a better battery and possibly a higher torque motor

I can't answer the 9.6v with speed gears question... by the time I put in 16:1s on my p90, I was already on mosfet and lipos.

Your gun is battery space limited, which means you have options that are few and far between. those who have highly tuned mpk5s that I've read about wire to an external lipo in a battery bag or peq or even just strapped to the side of the gun.

You've been given a ton of info on all your threads already, you just need to make a decision to try something... Either cut back on your spring power or back up to standard ratio gears and run the gun as is, or spend more money to try other options that may or may not work. That's really the question you're facing. If you want less headaches, which one is going to be easiest and reliable?

[Bar1975]

Originally Posted by Stealth

Madbull M120 Spring
G&P M120 motor
CA high torque ferrite motor
Lonex red piston
SHS 13:1 gearset

Battery:
GensAce 7.4v 20C 1200mah lipo
Firefox 9.6v 1200mah? NiMH
? 11.1v 15C ?mah lipo

Madbull M120 Spring
G&P M120 motor
CA high torque ferrite motor
Lonex red piston
SHS 13:1 gearset

Battery:
GensAce 7.4v 20C 1200mah lipo
Firefox 9.6v 1100mah NiMH
11.1v 15C 1100mah lipo

The 7.4 lipo will cycle the gun but it's a little sluggish it seems and at points will stick. The 9.6 doesn't seem to do anything.. pull the trigger and nothing happens at all. I seem to have no issues at all with the 11.1

I also just checked the batteries output and there doesn't seem to be an issue with a battery not charging properly or pushing out enough volts. Each respective battery is sitting at or near where it should be on my multimeter

[Stealth]

What kind of ROF are you getting with the 11.1?

[Bar1975]

have not checked with the latest set up but it sounds like 20+ fps

before the spring upgrade it was 25+