High Speed Gears Stripping Pistons

[wind_comm]

Originally Posted by lurkingknight

I can't remember if I have 1/4" or 3/16 for sorbo, but on both my p90 and g36 it's right on top of the original rubber pad on the cylinder head. So I've got way more than just the sorbo :P

I took the rubber pad off and sandwiched the sorbo for future durability...but yeah =D

[Bar1975]

working on this gun this weekend... keep you posted on the results

Picked up some valuable advice guys thanks. Now when i think about it the extra spacer on the piston head has probably caused the piston head to not align center with the piston body and causing friction in the cylinder.. who knows but its opening up more options than even just AOE or Pre-Engagement.

I'm going to check everything for piston friction as well as upgrade to better piston and harder spring. (spoke to a few people today though and most were surprised about an m120 or higher in a high speed set up.. we'll see i guess)

[MADDOG]

Good neo magnet motors can pull heavy duty springs with 13.1 ratio high speed gears with a good battery behind it. The days if needing torque up gear sets to pull heavier springs are long gone

[wind_comm]

Originally Posted by Bar1975

working on this gun this weekend... keep you posted on the results

Picked up some valuable advice guys thanks. Now when i think about it the extra spacer on the piston head has probably caused the piston head to not align center with the piston body and causing friction in the cylinder.. who knows but its opening up more options than even just AOE or Pre-Engagement.

I'm going to check everything for piston friction as well as upgrade to better piston and harder spring. (spoke to a few people today though and most were surprised about an m120 or higher in a high speed set up.. we'll see i guess)

the fastest (usable) setups run m150's =D

[Bar1975]

OK.. so I've made the recommended upgrades

1. Madbull M120 Spring
2. Lonex Burgundy Super Hard Piston with 10 Steel Teeth (swiss cheesed)
3. I even removed the bearing assembly from the piston head to lighten the piston even more (have a bearing spring guide)

Now i have another problem though. The 9.6V 1100Mah Stick battery i have in the gun no longer appears to have the guts to fire the gun. I press the trigger.. i hear the motor click a little but nothing happens. When i throw in my 11.1V Lipo it shoots normally.

I was originally running a G&P M120 motor but thought that might be too fast with the high speed gears and that's what was causing the pre-engagement so i put the stock Classic Army High Torque motor back in. (this seems like a pretty weak motor though... i can easily turn the pinion head with my fingers with little to no resistance)

I have a few suspicions:

1. The battery in combination with the stock motor just does not have enough guts to pull the upgraded M120 spring and piston (this lonex piston is quite heavy even after the lightening i did. The piston body itself without the piston head is ~17-20G)

2. The battery is just starting to crap out (the gun and battery are less than 6 months old though so it shouldn't be this)

3. The stock motor does not have enough torque to fire the gun running a 9.6V (which would explain why the LiPo can seem to turn it over enough to shoot the gun but can't be good on the motor)


So im back to more issues with this CA MP5K..

1. Should i buy a better quality high torque motor (something like the SHS High Torque?) I'm done spending a pile of cash on this thing.. so not getting an $80 motor..

2. Should i look for a better quality stick battery? (options are limited with the available space in the mp5k model)

3. both 1 & 2?

arghhH!!!!!

[SuperCriollo]

The SHS motor is pretty solid, mine runs like a champ!
I would test it with the new motor, if it doesnt work, also get a 7.4v lipo, wires, and a mosfet.

My M4 runs beautifully with that set-up.

[MADDOG]

Originally Posted by Bar1975

OK.. so I've made the recommended upgrades

1. Madbull M120 Spring
2. Lonex Burgundy Super Hard Piston with 10 Steel Teeth (swiss cheesed)
3. I even removed the bearing assembly from the piston head to lighten the piston even more (have a bearing spring guide)

Now i have another problem though. The 9.6V 1100Mah Stick battery i have in the gun no longer appears to have the guts to fire the gun. I press the trigger.. i hear the motor click a little but nothing happens. When i throw in my 11.1V Lipo it shoots normally.

I was originally running a G&P M120 motor but thought that might be too fast with the high speed gears and that's what was causing the pre-engagement so i put the stock Classic Army High Torque motor back in. (this seems like a pretty weak motor though... i can easily turn the pinion head with my fingers with little to no resistance)

I have a few suspicions:

1. The battery in combination with the stock motor just does not have enough guts to pull the upgraded M120 spring and piston (this lonex piston is quite heavy even after the lightening i did. The piston body itself without the piston head is ~17-20G)

2. The battery is just starting to crap out (the gun and battery are less than 6 months old though so it shouldn't be this)

3. The stock motor does not have enough torque to fire the gun running a 9.6V (which would explain why the LiPo can seem to turn it over enough to shoot the gun but can't be good on the motor)


So im back to more issues with this CA MP5K..

1. Should i buy a better quality high torque motor (something like the SHS High Torque?) I'm done spending a pile of cash on this thing.. so not getting an $80 motor..

2. Should i look for a better quality stick battery? (options are limited with the available space in the mp5k model)

3. both 1 & 2?

arghhH!!!!!

Put the M120 back in, it is not that fast or especially high torque if you are using a 9.6v only, airsoft stick batteries are crap and very low C rating even if they are lipo.

You need a good lipo battery that can pull 20 to 25 c constant these can be had from Stealth

Combine this with a lonex orange motor and your problems will be solved for quite sometime

The investment will be worth it if you intend to game alot

[Bar1975]

This is an MP5K.. there is very little room in this thing for thicker wires.. lipos..

do they even make a stick type lipo to fit in guns like this?

The gun itself was only $100 brand new.. i should have stopped with the upgrades a long time ago.. i just got carried away

[Trev140_0]

What connectors do you have on the battery? It they are the stock tamniya (spelling) you may have a bad connection.

Remember the battery needs to delivery AMPs to the motor. A badd conection is no different than a bad connection on your car battery.


A dead indication is if they terminals are loose in the white plastic.

I put a drop of crazy glue on the WIRE side of mine. DONT go crazy. It works.

I know there are all the guys here on the x connectors etc. I am formally an Industrial Electrician by trade working with 750,000 volts. Just me its an overkill and I am lazy to snip off the tamnyia's.

Try it.

Either way, you have the audience of some VERY smart dudes here. Take what they are saying as a gift.

[Trev140_0]

woo woo!

Check that!

I assumed you were using a decent lipo with 20c etc as Maddong wrote. If not, pitch them.

The NiMh if you are using are to go in the garbage now.

[Bar1975]

i get maybe needing a better battery but what i think you are all missing here is that this is an Mp5K.. a stick battery is the only thing that will slide down the length of this gun (sits on top of the gearbox)

Do they make 'stick' (has to be round as well) lipo's?

I upgrade everything i own to DEANS also..

I have a feeling this maybe a 'wire' issue.. my wires are chewed to crap now from all the work i've been doing on this thing. but still that wouldn't explain why with a lipo hooked up it works fine? (i just run the lipo i have on the outside of the gun for testing purposes. A 'final solution' will require the battery to be housed inside the gun)

[MADDOG]

Originally Posted by Bar1975

This is an MP5K.. there is very little room in this thing for thicker wires.. lipos..

do they even make a stick type lipo to fit in guns like this?

The gun itself was only $100 brand new.. i should have stopped with the upgrades a long time ago.. i just got carried away

This should fit and work great.

http://www.airsoftstore.ca/index.php...roducts_id=194

There are 3 things you can never skimp on if you want a great working shooter

1) Quality Battery, not all batteries are equal, different batteris of the same voltage from different suppliers can operate drastically different. A stock 9.6 battery that is supplied with any gun when you buy it is the lowest quality battery you can get, throw it away and get a proven one, you will notice the difference immediately (high c lipo or a stick with sanyo or intellect cells)

2) Quality motor (lonex orange), go with the best and you never have any issues, I cannot stress how important it is, more horespower and speed the better regardless if it is used to its full capacity

3) Solid piston, forget about the swiss cheesing and lightening everything. I use the piston bearings and bearing spring guides on all my guns with the lonex tough piston in stock format with quality 11.1v lipos (20c, 25c, and 65c) and they are all super fast from 350fps all the way up to 450 FPS.

I use all different gear sets from 13.1 to 18:1 using all the same components mentioned above just changing the gear ratios and springs.

Don't over think, with the added investment of say $80 dollars your can achieve everything you want with a $100 base gun.

[Bar1975]

i cant stick an 11.1 lipo in this thing it will fry the hell out of it. There is no room for me to upgrade the wire gauge.. just too tight of a space. In order to use DEANS i had to modify where the gearbox wires (front wired) comes out of the front of the gun and they now sit directly under the battery causing it to be an even tighter fit. When i slide the battery into the gun it slides over the gearbox wires all leading to the front. ( i also have no motivation to bother with a MOSFET for this thing.. i have way more expensive guns that i would put one of those in if i were to get one)

If i could find a 7.4 15-20C that would fit into this thing.. and the Lonex Orange or SHS High Torque (leaning towards shs as it's $20 cheaper) would that work together? What about my G&P M120.. i have one of those sitting around and would like to not have to buy a new motor at all to be honest.. sometimes we just have to make what we have work because with over 10 guns i have better guns i want to put my serious money into.

[MADDOG]

Again you are over thinking it, every gun I run still has taimya connectors, all the "real" AS mechanics laugh but my guns work on stock wiring and nothing frys but the trigger contacts after about 2 years. unless you intend to do 30 second bursts, that will fry things.

[Bar1975]

So i just slapped the G&P M120 motor back in this thing and the same thing is happening. Only the 11.1 Lipo will turn it over and shoot anything.

I have a decent quality crane stock 9.6V 2000Mah and even that wont get this thing to fire.

So with the new M120 Spring it appears the only battery that will turn over any kind of motor i currently own is a lipo.. that's insane though...how is everybody else running M120's and NiMh batteries? Not everybody swears by Lipos..

Is it possible i'm not seeing the real issue here? Could it be shimming that is too tight maybe? Should i crack this thing open again and start looking for tightness/friction in other areas? (damm though.. i've polished the GB piston rails.. lightened the piston.. shimmed the gears to what i guess is an ok job )

what else do i have to do!! LOL!!!

This little gun is quickly working itself into a spare parts only gun..