KWA vs. CA

[Crunchmeister]

Originally Posted by hattrick

I know you guys are talking AEGS but you couldn't PAY ME to use a KWA GBB.

+1

Well, as long as it's a V2. Their other guns are fine. I have no problems with them. But Armalites? Not a chance...

Plus that big KWA logo on the side of the receiver is ugly as hell too... I'd rather real trademarks or none at all.

[Skladfin]

Originally Posted by warbird

I would let that be decided by my gun doc. Since you guys know, how much would the average cost be too bring the CA up to par. It might just be easier for me to go with KWA, and cheaper. Can you switch lowers on KWAs?

Nope, can't switch lowers or uppers on KWA M4. They aren't TM compatible, it uses a different design. If you wanted to change the body, you'd have to go all out.

For upgrading a CA to 400FPS with good accuracy and reliability, you'd be looking at the following:

Prometheus M110 spring
Prometheus POM Bearing Piston Head
Prometheus AERO cylinderhead
Modify Poly Carb piston
Modify Bearing Spring Guide

Prometheus Airseal Hop Up rubber(Soft)
Prometheus NEO STRIKE Chamber one piece hop up unit
Prometheus 6.03mm Tightbore 363mm

That's about it. I don't reccomend Modify Cylinderhead because the impact rubber is not attached properly. One time it just fell off of the cylinderhead and I had to super glue it back on. And Modify POM piston heads have slightly small O-Ring that sometimes doesn't compress properly. The Modify M110 spring is stiffer than Prom M110 as well.

You can get those items from Airsoftparts.ca and Ehobbyasia.com

happy hunting

PS: That set up, if installed properly, should get you around 380~400FPS. I wouldn't reccomend going Prom M120 because it destroys mechbox slightly faster and will shoot around 420FPS

[warbird]

Yeah, fps limit here is 380. I'll probably go with CA due to reliability.

[Skladfin]

Originally Posted by warbird

Yeah, fps limit here is 380. I'll probably go with CA due to reliability.

When you get the bearing piston head. Don't install the Bearings, that should get your gun firing exactly around 380FPS

[Crunchmeister]

My C7 (originally a CA M15A4 rifle) has:

Modify bearing spring guide
Systema silent piston / cylinder head set
Prometheus MS110SP spring
(rest of the mechbox is stock)
Deepfire 6.04mm tightbore
Guarder clear hopup rubber

It shoots a consistent 380-385 fps and has sick range and accuracy.

[Schwag]

Originally Posted by ShelledPants

Were they, per chance, gamed in cold weather when they snapped? (I'm not defending KWA, I just want to know. )

The first one was gamed in near-zero weather, the other went 2 weeks ago when it was 15 degrees.
We all know cold makes them brittle but this one broke REALLY fast. It was practically new. And it wasn't that cold.

I didn't know both receivers were KWA only.
That would be a dealbreaker for me.

[The Saint]

Originally Posted by Skladfin

Nope, can't switch lowers or uppers on KWA M4. They aren't TM compatible, it uses a different design. If you wanted to change the body, you'd have to go all out.

What are we talking about specifically? Dimensions or design? IIRC, both KWA and CA use tabs (like TM) to hold the upper down.

I personally don't trust those tabs, even in metal (airsoft) guns, so I'd never get a CA or KWA.

[incrediboy729]

Originally Posted by warbird

Yeah, fps limit here is 380. I'll probably go with CA due to reliability.

*Thumbs up*
I will admit KWA has better performance out of box, but if you want something very reliable that you can tinker with CA is the best bet IMO.

I personally don't trust those tabs, even in metal (airsoft) guns, so I'd never get a CA or KWA.

Let me tell you the metal tabs on the CA are NOT going to break. Rock solid.
And CA has a different design, the back pin holds the mechbox in, the way you strip the recievers is different. On CA the front pin only keeps it from sliding off forwards, the "holding down" process is done by the curved nature of the mechbox top fitting with the curved nature of the upper reciever, plus to metal "pins" in the back. Or are you talking about those 2 pins and i'm just an idiot?

Oh I totally agree that 6,000 isn't anywhere near enough of a benchmark to judge whether or not it's reliable. I just checked the internals about a week ago when I put the stock spring back in after trying out a m100 that I had. Everything still looks good to go. There is a guy on the KWA forum that took photos of his stock internals after 120,000+ rounds and the damn thing looked brand new and that with a 11.8V 15c Li-Po in it. I personally use the Li-Po because I don't have to worry about swapping batteries in the middle of a game, I charge it up the night before a game and I know I'm going to get at least a bag of bb's out of it before I start noticing any change in it's performance.

Ok sorry my bad

Idk, i've just never trusted KWA, they seem to over-powered for what they are thus causing unreliability.

[m102404]

Either will make a good gun. KWA's are very nice right out of the box. CA's are so-so internals

CA upper receiver pins break...seen more than a few with either one or both pins cracked out of the receiver. More due to user abuse during reassembly than wear/tear.

I haven't seen KWA tabs break...but I suppose they could just like any other metal part.

I do not like the "proprietary" KWA nozzle/hopup setup. The logo on the receiver is horrid. Out of the box several have had poor compression at the piston head. The solid aluminum piston head is not loctited and, in my opinion, not a good idea. I fixed one that had come loose...it destroyed the rest of the mechbox (the gears survived intact, the rest was toast). Rest of the mechbox parts are usually very nice.

CA's mechboxes tend to suffer from sloppy assembly. Piston is hit and miss. Should have a metal bearing spring guide. CA nozzles are hit and miss too. But with just a few upgrade parts and a little TLC, they can run a long, long, long time. I have not had good luck with CA Motors lasting long for anything but sub 350 setups. Some Modify SS cylinder heads do not fit (there is a CA specific version)

CA metal rifles are very nice. Painted on trades are a disappointment...but it usually takes quite a bit of wear/tear before they fade into oblivion. Solid builds usually. Bug juice is not good for AEGs.

CA's are just marginally easier to work on (really splitting hairs here).

If I were buying one (for the purpose of upgrading or not) I'd buy a CA. Regardless of what brand, I'd give the mechbox a once over anyways.

[Skladfin]

Originally Posted by The Saint

What are we talking about specifically? Dimensions or design? IIRC, both KWA and CA use tabs (like TM) to hold the upper down.

I personally don't trust those tabs, even in metal (airsoft) guns, so I'd never get a CA or KWA.

Design, The KWA lower is desgined to take 2 piece hop up units, and quick release upper in mind

[warbird]

When I get the gun, If I do, I'll ask my gun doctor to install what he sees fit. He has a CA himself so that should help for sure.

[Crunchmeister]

Originally Posted by m102404

Painted on trades are a disappointment...but it usually takes quite a bit of wear/tear before they fade into oblivion.

I can't speak for other guns, but their Armalites have laser engraved trademarks, not painted.

[incrediboy729]

Originally Posted by Crunchmeister

I can't speak for other guns, but their Armalites have laser engraved trademarks, not painted.

To my knowledge +1 also

Design, The KWA lower is desgined to take 2 piece hop up units, and quick release upper in mind

The JG 614 has one of those, it worked ok and made taking it apart a breeze.......until it broke on my friends gun. We looked everywhere for a 2 piece original but couldn't find it, so we ended up having to replace with a metal one piece, which required milling to make it fit. And even to this day everything doesn't quite work right. Figures too after we bought and installed it, we found a replacement on airsoftgi (they just came in stock). *sighs*

[Amos]

Originally Posted by The Saint

What are we talking about specifically? Dimensions or design? IIRC, both KWA and CA use tabs (like TM) to hold the upper down.

I personally don't trust those tabs, even in metal (airsoft) guns, so I'd never get a CA or KWA.

CA doesn't use tabs... don't know where you got that idea from.

CA uses the same upper receiver system that G&P does.

In my experiences CA are much higher quality than KWA... KWA's just doing the same thing that chinese clone companies are.. They're releasing stock guns that are "pre-upgraded" with lower-end parts to make them more attractive to new players.

CA's Aluminum bodies are very good, same with their internals (the new versions of the guns have very solid internals)

[Crunchmeister]

Originally Posted by Amos

CA doesn't use tabs... don't know where you got that idea from.

CA uses the same upper receiver system that G&P does.

In my experiences CA are much higher quality than KWA... KWA's just doing the same thing that chinese clone companies are.. They're releasing stock guns that are "pre-upgraded" with lower-end parts to make them more attractive to new players.

CA's Aluminum bodies are very good, same with their internals (the new versions of the guns have very solid internals)

+1 to all that. From what I gather, it's been a few years now since CA have made Armalite receivers with tabs. And I've yet to see a metal body that matches the quality of a stock CA. That lower receiver is about as solid as it gets. Ditto for the upper. IMO, even most aftermarket receivers don't even come close to comparing to what CA includes on stock guns.