New CF LBV

[pugs144]

Originally Posted by CARL

+1
Exactly

Man it also looks like they have amateurs picked to trial the gear, the CF takes so long to get anything done, thank god were not in a real war!

And I'm guessing you're qualified to judge, based on snippets of video, what's professional and what's amateurish?

I'm sorry the war you watch in the comfort of your living room isn't real enough for you; it was real enough for our 131 KIA.

I don't know what you consider a "real war" but welcome to 4th Generation Warfare. Look it up.

[CARL]

Originally Posted by pugs144

And I'm guessing you're qualified to judge, based on snippets of video, what's professional and what's amateurish?

I'm sorry the war you watch in the comfort of your living room isn't real enough for you; it was real enough for our 131 KIA.

I don't know what you consider a "real war" but welcome to 4th Generation Warfare. Look it up.

Oh Dear God....

More men died in a few hours of one battle in ancient times then this entire Middle East BS, not that does not mean I think less of any of the men who have died or fought. My comment pertains more to the way this war has been conducted by the power's to be, and the lack of support by the home front.

Secondly I was in the CF, and have served for this nation, so i do have and educated & experienced opinion.

So go drink your keiths, curse the US military to feed the small man's ego & praise your C7 which is now again owned by the US. keep following the herd, for it takes a war that has been going on for 8 years to figure out a new LBV is needed that could have easily been addressed 5 years ago....


Like for fuck sakes we send only 2000 men there, and expect shit to get done, small feudal power's sent more men to subdue nations before. You call this a war? Well it is a war, but we don't treat it like it is as a nation, the CF is at war , but not Canada.

Also our hands are tied in this war anyways!

As for gear by the time these idiots figure out what there going to buy will be out of Afghanistan according to our agreement of pullout by 2011, if they keep with that!

carry on...

1.) Canada is not at war in the Middle East, Afghanistan is in South West Asia

2.) Who cares if Diemaco is no more an its Colt Canada now.

3.) As for the amount of troops Canada sends, well we aren't a giant military an can't send thousands upon thousands of troops. And we have more than 2000 troops in Afghanistan.


4.) Our hands are tied in this war? how so? Have you been to Afghanistan? If so where/when?

[pugs144]

Ugh. After that whole rambling diatribe about drinking Keith's and cursing the US military (??), I'll say this. The need for a new load carriage system acknowledges our soldiers are warfighters and need gear to help them perform as such in current AND future operations.

[The Saint]

This is a thread about the new CF LBV, not a soap box for misgivings about the war.

[RecceGod]

Originally Posted by -Skeletor-

1.) Canada is not at war in the Middle East, Afghanistan is in South West Asia

2.) Who cares if Diemaco is no more an its Colt Canada now.

3.) As for the amount of troops Canada sends, well we aren't a giant military an can't send thousands upon thousands of troops. And we have more than 2000 troops in Afghanistan.


4.) Our hands are tied in this war? how so? Have you been to Afghanistan? If so where/when?

I didn't dare say a thing a about Carl's comments, but I totally agree with Puggs and Skeletor.

This trial was done here at my unit. I've seen quite a few familiar faces, guys who are in the R22R and who fought on my roto. And I would also trust that PPCLI MWO, project manager, who was actually appointed the task after making comments on the current issue kit (and he's done a couple of tours in the sandbox)... You can't say who's who and who's done what from that vid. I can tell you the the experience was on site.

You also can't pass a jugement on the account of an Army News videoclip, they're amateur anyways...


And god! So much shiny kit, made me drool all week...

[Farmboy]

would be preferred that the new rig be Canadian-built as opposed to giving that money to a foreign company

The problem with doing this is we re-invent the wheel every single time, wasting money and time, hense the reason we have the TV when the rest of the world went modular years ago.

Take something as simple as the attachment system itself for example. Are they going to go with MALICE clips? Is the CF willing to pay for the license to use the MOLLE system?

Unfortunatly to many people think the MOLLE webbing is patented, it's not. A couple attachement systems are.

If we go with a COTS design, how much are we willing to pay for the license to produce it?

Buy COTS from the mfg then there is no need to pay for the lic.. Problem will be the outrage that the money went to the US. The issue is no one up here in Canada makes gear comparible to the top US makers.




One of the problems faced is the budget as well. Anything over $25,000 needs to go through government/pwgsc for approval.

I've sent in a number of quotes that were for 1500 pouches of one sort or another. None approved because it was over the $25,000. It means that to procure 1500 of anything quickly it needs to be under $16.66 per item.

I'm sure there are other channels that can be used to get what the guys need but I will be amazed if the next ROTO gets anything in large numbers.

[Kokanee]

Originally Posted by CARL

....curse the US military to feed the small man's ego...

I have in the past, frequently, and in a very colourful language indeed cursed the US military. But not to feed our "small army syndrome" ego; instead on ops I have cursed the US military for;

- Unqualified/incompetent national guardsmen operating aircraft who drop bombs waaaay off target;
- Thinking that the answer to any tactical problem is 2x 1000lb paveways;
- Ref the last point, not believing us when we tell them they missed; and
- Generally being culturally insensitive dicks, telling "brown people/snad n*gger" jokes whilst hiding out in an air raid shelter w/ local nationals who speak perfect English....

Originally Posted by CARL

...praise your C7 which is now again owned by the US.

So? Diemaco never really innovated anything. They licensed the Armalite design and proceeded to sit on their laurels with the Cdn Mil contract and very few foreign sales... In a free market those who are innovative and progressive are generally rewarded with success, and those who are not are bought or absorbed by the more successful.

----------------

On topic, I look forward to any developments in the areas of load carriage for the individual soldier; any direction will be better than the current solution.

[Mudder]

Ah! I see I'm not the only one who is tired of Carl.

[pugs144]

Darren, I hear ya brother. Like I said, you've got logistical, political, and policy-driven forces driving the beast and that beast is slow to learn. I'm optimistic that the end product will be beneficial to the troops, question is how long until we see it.

Originally Posted by Farmboy

The problem with doing this is we re-invent the wheel every single time, wasting money and time, hense the reason we have the TV when the rest of the world went modular years ago.



Unfortunatly to many people think the MOLLE webbing is patented, it's not. A couple attachement systems are.



Buy COTS from the mfg then there is no need to pay for the lic.. Problem will be the outrage that the money went to the US. The issue is no one up here in Canada makes gear comparible to the top US makers.




One of the problems faced is the budget as well. Anything over $25,000 needs to go through government/pwgsc for approval.

I've sent in a number of quotes that were for 1500 pouches of one sort or another. None approved because it was over the $25,000. It means that to procure 1500 of anything quickly it needs to be under $16.66 per item.

I'm sure there are other channels that can be used to get what the guys need but I will be amazed if the next ROTO gets anything in large numbers.

[Farmboy]

I'm optimistic that the end product will be beneficial to the troops, question is how long until we see it.

Hopefully sooner than later.

[Boche]

That LBV is the shit!

Originally Posted by memel

That LBV is the shit!

?

You are referring to?

[Boche]

Originally Posted by -Skeletor-

?

You are referring to?

What are you on about?

Originally Posted by memel

What are you on about?

Uh.. am I on crazy pills or something


You posted saying "That LBV is the shit!" but theres been a couple of names of rigs tossed out in this thread, etc so what are you referring to when you said "That LBV is the shit!"