Hmmm, what's wrong with this mechbox?

damage · January 27th, 2006, 18:07

That is so much lube. Actually too much lube specially on the cylinder is not good. Excess lube goes out the nozzle during compression and goes to the chamber and if not cleaned regularly lube becomes sticky and BB's will get jammed.

MadMax · January 27th, 2006, 18:37

At first glance, I'd say at least that your cylinder is backwards. The port is supposed to be closer to the rear. IRC the SR and other M4 variants put the port pretty far rearwards. Only the very short barrel AEGs put the port close to the middle. I don't think any put it that far forward.

It wouldn't be the cause of your electrical issues, but you'd certainly not push enough air.

CDN_Stalker · January 27th, 2006, 19:02

Carl, you read the latch spring was improperly installed as well?

Ya, huge noticablility with the port on the cylinder. Is why I pointed out it'd be an easy one. Hazard decided to buy a new cylinder and head for it. Otherwise, even after jamming up, everything is cool inside the mechbox.

MadMax · January 27th, 2006, 19:15

I glossed over that one as I thought that the issue was resolved.

Certainly looks gooey in that mechbox. It's often not too much of a problem though if you make sure that they cylinder window doesn't open towards the inside of the mechbox. It should point outside to prevent grease from getting into they cyl thru the window. I like to wipe down the inside of a cyl before reassembly leaving only a very thin film of lubricant. Too much grease eventually finds it's way around the oring and gets to the inside of they cyl and gets blown into the barrel.

CDN_Stalker · January 27th, 2006, 19:33

I found after removing the piston a huge glob of grease on the sides and head of the piston, so I wiped it all off and left a bit on the O-Ring of the head. Found, as I said, a good amount of grease all around the selector toggle (under the sector gear) and it was enough if not more than the size of a BB. Basically I took off all the excess grease from the areas that no mechanical contact comes itno play. Also spent a bit of time clearing the black crap off the contacts the trigger block runs into (totally unsure the names of contact parts. Never had to talk or discuss them before).

All is back together, when I get the chance I'll run it through it's paces. Hazard told me there was a good chunk of lamp cord in between the small connector that attaches to the back of the receiver, and the large battey connector that connects to the battery itself. I think I sorted it out to give extra length to the cable to allow easier battery hook ups. Will do a better rig/splice for that.

Since you are here Carl, might not be a bad idea to link this thread to the one you did on the ported vs. non-ported cylinders in relation to barrel length. Since it got brought up a few times here, why not? Was an outstanding piece you did! Even if a little hard for average minds to follow.

ILLusion · January 28th, 2006, 17:36

Every single stock & virgin Marui and ICS M4/M733/SR-16 gearbox I've worked on had a ported cylinder.

Quote:

Originally Posted by CDN_Stalker

Hmm, ok. I might not have noticed on some of the cylinders I've dealt with, but everytime I saw one I used to wonder "Why on some and not others?" Need to get MadMax or Illusion to break out their comments.

Just used the "Vondnik Shim Technique" and found the sector gear is set up nice, but there is a 0.5mm movement with the spur and bevel gear. Not comfortable with it, prefer a little less, but I guess we can't fault the guy for a reasonable job doing it.

CDN_Stalker · January 28th, 2006, 20:45

Guess Apoc's 733 is an oddball then, it has a full cylinder. Like I said, I've worked on all the variants, but never really noticed porting vs. non-porting.

Update ont eh mechbox, as I was reassmbling it, I noticed the trigger retrun spring was also missing. Go figure, it was included sperately in a small bag of parts. Guess the guy had it as a left over, didn't know where it went so just included it with a light bulb, a few extra screws and whatnot. Glad I can work on mechboxes, cuz I'd hate to have this guy work on my internals!

Trader rating · January 29th, 2006, 14:55

My SR came ported. So do most AEGs that are under 590mm barrels if im not mistaken

CDN_Stalker · January 29th, 2006, 16:01

Ok guys, thanks for the info, I'll stand corrected now. I think the last M4 I had come across my bench was back on the fall, and prior to that were M4s, the 733 (with full cylinder, 100% of that because out of curiousity I tried it in my MP5, found my fps went down by 30fps, switched back), SR-16s, etc. So recently just did some more work on the 733 (changed new internals over to the reinforced mechbox), full cylinder still there, and a G&P SPR last week. Guess I assumed the TM 733 had a stock cylinder in it, is the shortest of all the Armalite inner barrels, so anything over that length had full cylinders, and anything under that length had ported. Just begs the question: If the stock 733 had never been opened before me, how did it get a full cylinder? Might explain the wildly fluctuating fps readings (360-390fps) we got last spring with it.

DYORD · February 6th, 2007, 13:46

so where in the mechbox those two shims are located when you saw it??

The shims should be on the gears.. hahahahaha

HellRanger · February 6th, 2007, 14:13

Thanks, but this thread is over a year old.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DYORD

so where in the mechbox those two shims are located when you saw it??

The shims should be on the gears.. hahahahaha

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January 27th, 2006, 18:07	#16
damage Trader rating Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Port Coquitlam, BC	That is so much lube. Actually too much lube specially on the cylinder is not good. Excess lube goes out the nozzle during compression and goes to the chamber and if not cleaned regularly lube becomes sticky and BB's will get jammed. __________________ Team P.I.M.P. Vancouver BC -Guntech(PM or E-mail only)

January 27th, 2006, 18:37	#17
MadMax Delierious Designer of Dastardly Detonations Trader rating Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: in the dark recesses of some metal chip filled machine shop	At first glance, I'd say at least that your cylinder is backwards. The port is supposed to be closer to the rear. IRC the SR and other M4 variants put the port pretty far rearwards. Only the very short barrel AEGs put the port close to the middle. I don't think any put it that far forward. It wouldn't be the cause of your electrical issues, but you'd certainly not push enough air. __________________ Want nearly free GBB gas?

January 27th, 2006, 19:02	#18
CDN_Stalker Official ASC Bladesmith Trader rating Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Ottawa, Ont.	Carl, you read the latch spring was improperly installed as well? Ya, huge noticablility with the port on the cylinder. Is why I pointed out it'd be an easy one. Hazard decided to buy a new cylinder and head for it. Otherwise, even after jamming up, everything is cool inside the mechbox. __________________ STKR Knives http://www.facebook.com/#!/pages/STK...17036668380871

January 27th, 2006, 19:15	#19
MadMax Delierious Designer of Dastardly Detonations Trader rating Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: in the dark recesses of some metal chip filled machine shop	I glossed over that one as I thought that the issue was resolved. Certainly looks gooey in that mechbox. It's often not too much of a problem though if you make sure that they cylinder window doesn't open towards the inside of the mechbox. It should point outside to prevent grease from getting into they cyl thru the window. I like to wipe down the inside of a cyl before reassembly leaving only a very thin film of lubricant. Too much grease eventually finds it's way around the oring and gets to the inside of they cyl and gets blown into the barrel. __________________ Want nearly free GBB gas?

January 27th, 2006, 19:33	#20
CDN_Stalker Official ASC Bladesmith Trader rating Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Ottawa, Ont.	I found after removing the piston a huge glob of grease on the sides and head of the piston, so I wiped it all off and left a bit on the O-Ring of the head. Found, as I said, a good amount of grease all around the selector toggle (under the sector gear) and it was enough if not more than the size of a BB. Basically I took off all the excess grease from the areas that no mechanical contact comes itno play. Also spent a bit of time clearing the black crap off the contacts the trigger block runs into (totally unsure the names of contact parts. Never had to talk or discuss them before). All is back together, when I get the chance I'll run it through it's paces. Hazard told me there was a good chunk of lamp cord in between the small connector that attaches to the back of the receiver, and the large battey connector that connects to the battery itself. I think I sorted it out to give extra length to the cable to allow easier battery hook ups. Will do a better rig/splice for that. Since you are here Carl, might not be a bad idea to link this thread to the one you did on the ported vs. non-ported cylinders in relation to barrel length. Since it got brought up a few times here, why not? Was an outstanding piece you did! Even if a little hard for average minds to follow. __________________ STKR Knives http://www.facebook.com/#!/pages/STK...17036668380871

January 28th, 2006, 20:45	#22
CDN_Stalker Official ASC Bladesmith Trader rating Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Ottawa, Ont.	Guess Apoc's 733 is an oddball then, it has a full cylinder. Like I said, I've worked on all the variants, but never really noticed porting vs. non-porting. Update ont eh mechbox, as I was reassmbling it, I noticed the trigger retrun spring was also missing. Go figure, it was included sperately in a small bag of parts. Guess the guy had it as a left over, didn't know where it went so just included it with a light bulb, a few extra screws and whatnot. Glad I can work on mechboxes, cuz I'd hate to have this guy work on my internals! __________________ STKR Knives http://www.facebook.com/#!/pages/STK...17036668380871

January 29th, 2006, 14:55	#23
Droc Guest Trader rating	My SR came ported. So do most AEGs that are under 590mm barrels if im not mistaken

January 29th, 2006, 16:01	#24
CDN_Stalker Official ASC Bladesmith Trader rating Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Ottawa, Ont.	Ok guys, thanks for the info, I'll stand corrected now. I think the last M4 I had come across my bench was back on the fall, and prior to that were M4s, the 733 (with full cylinder, 100% of that because out of curiousity I tried it in my MP5, found my fps went down by 30fps, switched back), SR-16s, etc. So recently just did some more work on the 733 (changed new internals over to the reinforced mechbox), full cylinder still there, and a G&P SPR last week. Guess I assumed the TM 733 had a stock cylinder in it, is the shortest of all the Armalite inner barrels, so anything over that length had full cylinders, and anything under that length had ported. Just begs the question: If the stock 733 had never been opened before me, how did it get a full cylinder? Might explain the wildly fluctuating fps readings (360-390fps) we got last spring with it. __________________ STKR Knives http://www.facebook.com/#!/pages/STK...17036668380871

February 6th, 2007, 13:46	#25
DYORD Trader rating Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Philippines	so where in the mechbox those two shims are located when you saw it?? The shims should be on the gears.. hahahahaha __________________ MORE FPS :banghead:

Hmmm, what's wrong with this mechbox?

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