[Review] G&P Dual Laser Designator / Illuminator (DBAL A2)

[bobotea]

**Please read follow up posts on important information regarding the eye safety of the lasers**



The G&P Dual Laser Designator / Illuminator (DBAL A2) is a great alternative to the real thing, for those looking for a durable and accurate replica with all the functions this is your device! To set the context, I use this device on my WE MK18 Mod1 Open bolt GBBR in conjunction with my NOD’s. This device sports a visible red laser, infrared laser, and an infrared illuminator.


Build Quality:
The build quality is top notch for airsoft, it is not made of zinc/pot metal but rather is of aluminum construction. The unit itself weights about a half pound and is similar in size to PEQ15, although is taller due to the quick detach mount (it will require the user to utilize a >1/3 co whiteness mount in order to clear the device) (I can still use my KAC irons with this device, to give one perspective the device cuts off the front iron sight just below where the front post starts).



The quick detach mount can be adjusted via a flat head screw opposite of the lever, allowing the device to adapt to spec and offspec rails. The coating of the device is anodized and the lettering is laser engraved which is a nice touch. All the trademarks and control texts are accurate to the real DBAL A2. This device also features rubber covers that can be flipped in front of the recessed lenses for protection.



Controls:
The G&P device features two control nobs located on the rear of the device. The left knob controls the power (momentary low, off, momentary high, on low power, and on high power) and the right knob controls the features from (visible pointer, IR illuminator, IR pointer & illuminator, and IR pointer).



To activate the features (red laser, IR laser, and or IR illuminator) one must press the fire button located on the top of the device, which has a nice tactile feel, or utilize the provided remote switch. The provided remote switch attaches to the rear of the device via a straight 3.5mm jack and is button in design thus utilizing momentary on is tricky, to utilize momentary on the user must hold down the button for more than 2 seconds, on release the device will turn off – a quick click of the button will leave the device on constant on. I am not sure if this was the intended design of the switch but I personally like this feature because it gives me the ability to utilize momentary or constant on regardless of my device settings.



Now one of the main drawbacks of this device, zeroing its features, this occurs via two sets of zeroing controls. Although the IR illuminator has its own set of zeroing knobs, the IR laser and red laser share the same set of windage/elevation knobs. Not only are the knobs for both the illuminator and lasers loose at some points of rotation and have an inconsistent clicking feeling but the lasers cannot be zeroed independently and therefore the user must choose what laser to zero, the IR or visible. For me I do not utilize the visible laser, as in reality it serves to give me no tactical advantage on the battle field, but I would still like to have the ability to have it zeroed. Another drawback stems from the knobs themselves, due to “loose” nature they are easily bumped during use and thus prone to losing zero, to avoid this problem I witnessed mark them by using a sharpie paint pen. It is worth mentioning that although the knobs are easily bumped out of place the device does not lose zero under the heavy recoil of a GBBR open bolt.



Features:
The device runs off of 1xCR123 battery, the device runtime is unknown to me but I have been using this device for approximately 4 months and have not had to replace it. The IR illuminator is nothing more than an IR laser with less focus; the spot/flood it produces is slim to none approximately 1 foot in diameter at a distance of 5 meters. The illuminator has a maximum effective distance of approximately 50 meters on a moonlit night, this is not ideal, but for ~$170 devices it is to be expected. On the other hand the Red laser and IR laser are more than enough for airsoft engagement distances, the Red laser is very very bright and I would not recommend it to be used in cqc situations as it could damage people’s eyes. The IR laser is <5mw so it does not produce a “line” like real PEQ boxes but rather acts as like a regular laser pointer, the IR laser has an effective distance of ~150-75 meters on a moonlit night (depending on your NODS).



Conclusion: (4/5)
All in all, for a device that is ~$170 I would say it is great for airsoft BUT airsoft only, I would not recommend use for real steal application. For the milsim, realism, or geardo player I would highly recommend this device but due to some of its draw backs I cannot give it a perfect 5.

Pros:
-solid construction
-retains zero under GBBR recoil
-accurate text
-remote switch allowing for momentary and constant on
-powerful lasers
-good battery life? (see follow up posts)
Cons:
-cannot zero lasers independently (can only zero IR or visible laser)
-illuminator spot is very small and almost unusable?(see follow up posts)

PS: this is my first review so all feedback is welcome

[Danke]

Nice reveiw, maybe all you need is some photos of what it emits.

[FirestormX]

Thanks for the review - I thought it was great. =)

[Cico]

I have the same unit. My illuminator is huge. you need to twist the shroud to increase the size. Also what NVG are you using to view it. I had gen 2 and it was ok but now with a PVS14 its like daylight. i personaly focus the illuminator to look like an Ir laser as the laser really doe not have a documented saftey. I do find myself using the red laser when zeroing as i can walk the lazer into the impact then adjust the ironsight from there..

All in all a good unit. my only real torture test was at Black sheep last year when it ran for about 8-10 hrs strait.(using momentary switch)

Con is it is a hog on batteries. for every 4 hrs of use its 1 battery.

[bobotea]

Originally Posted by Cico

I have the same unit. My illuminator is huge. you need to twist the shroud to increase the size. Also what NVG are you using to view it. I had gen 2 and it was ok but now with a PVS14 its like daylight. i personaly focus the illuminator to look like an Ir laser as the laser really doe not have a documented saftey. I do find myself using the red laser when zeroing as i can walk the lazer into the impact then adjust the ironsight from there..

All in all a good unit. my only real torture test was at Black sheep last year when it ran for about 8-10 hrs strait.(using momentary switch)

Con is it is a hog on batteries. for every 4 hrs of use its 1 battery.

Wow... i totally missed the focus ring on the illuminator, fixed it this morning, it is much more usable now! thanks!(i am only using a gen1 nvd wanting a pvs14 but i am to poor right now). As per the battery life i had a feeling that it would be crappy. For the IR laser i feel that it is eye safe because it has a similar signature to that of a DBAL I2 which has a <5mw eyesafe laser.

PS, i will try and post pictures through my NODS tonight unless Cico would like to as he has GEN3 while i have GEN1 NODS

[ShelledPants]

Originally Posted by bobotea

Wow... i totally missed the focus ring on the illuminator, fixed it this morning, it is much more usable now! thanks!(i am only using a gen1 nvd wanting a pvs14 but i am to poor right now). As per the battery life i had a feeling that it would be crappy. For the IR laser i feel that it is eye safe because it has a similar signature to that of a DBAL I2 which has a <5mw eyesafe laser.

PS, i will try and post pictures through my NODS tonight unless Cico would like to as he has GEN3 while i have GEN1 NODS

I know Cico touched on it... but I want to emphasize this: Do not use the IR laser against other people. It is not rated for eye safety and could easily blind someone, yourself included.

I do not care if you feel it is fine to shine this thing into your mother's eyes. It has no documentation and is a hazard to anyone on the field. Do not use the IR laser.

Do not use the IR laser.

Do not use the IR laser.

Get it?

This is not your eyes, this is other people's eyes. My eyes. Don't fuck with them, please.

I also would like to tack on here:

LDI DBAL-I2 specs:

R LASER SPEC:
———————————-
IR Class:
Class I (eye safe)
IR Output:
0.7mW
IR Beam:
0.3 mrad
IR Laser WL:
835 nm
IR Range:
250 Meters
---------------------

That is <0.7mW

[bobotea]

Originally Posted by ShelledPants

I know Cico touched on it... but I want to emphasize this: Do not use the IR laser against other people. It is not rated for eye safety and could easily blind someone, yourself included.

I do not care if you feel it is fine to shine this thing into your mother's eyes. It has no documentation and is a hazard to anyone on the field. Do not use the IR laser.

Do not use the IR laser.

Do not use the IR laser.

Get it?

This is not your eyes, this is other people's eyes. My eyes. Don't fuck with them, please.

I also would like to tack on here:

LDI DBAL-I2 specs:

R LASER SPEC:
———————————-
IR Class:
Class I (eye safe)
IR Output:
0.7mW
IR Beam:
0.3 mrad
IR Laser WL:
835 nm
IR Range:
250 Meters
---------------------

That is <0.7mW

Yes i understand and i would not like to encourage use of the device if it could lead to injury, i was simply expressing my personal opinion. I do not know where you are retrieving your facts on
the DBAL I2 but on the LDI website it clearly states <5mw laser... I understand your sincerity but next time ShelledPants if you want to express yourself you DO NOT need to portray yourself in such a brash condecending fashion, i am an adult and am here to have a intelligent discussion on the use of this device and am NOT here to have an ego bash with you...


"Green Visible Pointer (<5mW) with IR Pointer* (<5mW)"
http://www.laserdevices.com/index.cfm/p-DBAL_I2_163.htm

[ShelledPants]

Originally Posted by bobotea

Yes i understand and i would not like to encourage use of the device if it could lead to injury, i was simply expressing my personal opinion. I do not know where you are retrieving your facts on
the DBAL I2 but on the LDI website it clearly states <5mw laser... I understand your sincerity but next time ShelledPants if you want to express yourself you DO NOT need to portray yourself in such a brash condecending fashion, i am an adult and am here to have a intelligent discussion on the use of this device and am NOT here to have an ego bash with you...


"Green Visible Pointer (<5mW) with IR Pointer* (<5mW)"
http://www.laserdevices.com/index.cfm/p-DBAL_I2_163.htm

When you buy an LDI Laser, feel free to use it, I love mine.

G&P Lasers are not LDI, no matter how close they represent their product, and are not to spec regardless of their printed material.

LDI has a lovely website, and lots of products, the one you've presented is available.

The one I presented, is not listed, because LDI doesn't advertise many of the products for sale to Civilians. My presented specs are the eye safe variant found on the TNVC website. It is a class 1 laser and safe for training (or airsoft, your choice).

Here is a link:
http://tnvc.com/shop/ldi-dbal-i2-class-1-ir-laser/

Also, here are the more dangerous Law Enforcement and Mil Lasers with lightsaber mode:
http://tnvc.com/shop/ldi-dbal-i2-high-power-laser/
http://tnvc.com/shop/laser-devices-inc-dbal-i2/

I hope that answers your questions.

I made my previous point very blunt, because you are endorsing the use of an undocumented laser for use in a sport which can injure someone from a very large distance, in a published review on a high traffic website, and I wanted to nip that idea in the bud. I shoot at night. I like my eyes.

Can I lastly direct your attention to the picture attached to all of the DBAL's you've listed. It's on the right hand side and will expand when you click it.



And because I'm no expert in lasers, I'm doing some research while typing. Wikipedia is not the best source, but here's some light reading for you.

As found at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laser_safety#Class_IIIb

Class IIIb
Lasers in this class may cause damage if the beam enters the eye directly. This generally applies to lasers powered from 5–200 mW. Lasers in this category can cause permanent eye damage with exposures of 1/100th of a second or less depending on the strength of the laser. A diffuse reflection is generally not hazardous but specular reflections can be just as dangerous as direct exposures. Protective eyewear is recommended when direct beam viewing of Class IIIb lasers may occur. Lasers at the high power end of this class may also present a fire hazard and can lightly burn skin. Many laser pointers at this output level are now available in this category.

[bobotea]

ahhh perfect, this is is great info and can only serve to better the airsoft community thanks for the good research! As per the LDI laser i am familiar with the models and have been currently looking to purchase one as well for my real steel from TNVC but was wondering how you acquired a US DND export permit as a Canadian civilian? if you dont want to share that info on this thread please PM me.

[ShelledPants]

Ebay. lol.

[bobotea]

Semi-necro post but wanted to get the info out, finally received an official response back from G&P took 2 months though...lol. Now for the record

"Dear ---,

Thanks for interesting in our products.

The GP-LSP003 is 635nm, 10mw.


Thanks & regards,

Lavender CHOW"

[Kimbo]

Too bad they didn't say what the power of the IR laser was.

[ShelledPants]

Originally Posted by bobotea

Semi-necro post but wanted to get the info out, finally received an official response back from G&P took 2 months though...lol. Now for the record

"Dear ---,

Thanks for interesting in our products.

The GP-LSP003 is 635nm, 10mw.


Thanks & regards,

Lavender CHOW"

Woah. Class IIIb right there. Dangerous. Good follow up.

[Gish]

Originally Posted by bobotea

Semi-necro post but wanted to get the info out, finally received an official response back from G&P took 2 months though...lol. Now for the record

"Dear ---,

Thanks for interesting in our products.

The GP-LSP003 is 635nm, 10mw.


Thanks & regards,

Lavender CHOW"

Thats the latest model which does not have IR

[bobotea]

Originally Posted by Gish

Thats the latest model which does not have IR

mmm interesting good catch , they have specifically been avoiding answering my IR questions. Still assume it is not eye safe.