trigger response build opinions/advice

[Intelligence_Dream]

So I'm looking to overhaul my V2 gearbox weapons I'm only concerned with trigger response rate of fire is not important to me as I'm mostly a semi auto only player.

Here is a list of the parts I'm thinking of using:
10:1 siegtek or similar gears single sector gear
Simple MOSFET
11.1v 1.4 amp 15c 20c burst lipo
Wired to deans
m120 spring ( looking for 400 fps)
Jg blue motor

If there are better parts for the job any suggestions would be welcome. For a motor I'm just looking for something to spin up fast with enough torque to pull the necessary spring and be as battery efficient as possible.

I left out other parts as I didn't feel they related to trigger response but if they are relevant feel free to include them.

[pestobanana]

Sounds like you did some research and you are on the right track. Everyone does their builds differently, here are my suggestions.

-You do not need 10:1 gears. SHS 12:1 or SHS 13:1 is good enough.
-You do not need a 22 TPA motor, ~16 TPA is what you're looking for. SHS HT is my recommendation.
-Your lipo is garbage, get some that have a rating of 25C or higher. Turnigy makes 1.1 Ah 25-50C lipos that fit easily within buffer tube builds.
-M120 is overkill, rework your air seal. With a perfect air seal, you should get 450 FPS with a M120. M100 should put you close to 400, my latest build does 425FPS with a M110.
-If you do decide to go with the route I'm suggesting, you'll need to short stroke 2 teeth from the release side and add a sector delay clip. You will also need to bump up from a M100 to a M110 for the FPS you are looking for.

[Wrath144]

This will get you good trigger response, but you may want to consider a BTC mosfet for the hair trigger goodness. Of course you could do a hair trigger without the BTC but it's soooo much easier with it, and it comes with a whack load of other features.

*when I say hair trigger, I mean reduced travel.

[pestobanana]

Originally Posted by Wrath144

This will get you good trigger response, but you may want to consider a BTC mosfet for the hair trigger goodness. Of course you could do a hair trigger without the BTC but it's soooo much easier with it, and it comes with a whack load of other features.

*when I say hair trigger, I mean reduced travel.

lol "consider"... Good luck getting your hands on one.

[lurkingknight]

I don't think you understand. Trigger response (as in complete cycle time) is a direct result of fast rate of fire guns. You will have ridiculous auto fire rate whether you want it or not, that's unavoidable if you want this kind of trigger response.

step it back down to 13:1s

put more C and mah into your battery.

The reason why is even with perfect shimming this build will draw some serious amps.. more than likely overdrawing that shitty stick lipo. That battery's max burst discharge is not even 30 amps. A 13:1 build will draw 20-22 amps constant and spike as high as 100amps even higher. A 10:1 will draw at least that amperage, probably more.

Any extended full auto or multiple fast semi trigger pulls will puff up that lipo.

You can also frankentorque that motor... take a higher TPA armature and put it in the blue can, you'll get more efficient draw and more torque.

That build has the potential of running to the 40rps range with 11.1 lipos.

Unless you're willing to run an external battery bag for a 4 amp battery, you're going for serious overkill there.

13:1s already have wicked trigger response in similar builds.

120 with a bearing spring guide and no piston bearing should give you 1.4~ J

Or

110 spring with both spring guide and piston bearings in place.

You'll need sorbo at the very least. 10:1s might require steel rack and swisscheese.

Of course if you want to drop 140$ on the siegeteks, go right ahead and run it off a big 7.4, you'll still get in the high 20s to mid 30s rps. But again, find more C and mah.

[ThunderCactus]

Ptws only shoot around 1300rpm and they have excellent trigger response.
Where you actually lose most of your response time is in the half inch trigger pull. Thats a lot of travel to repeat.
The btc specter mosfet is the best way to go but there are mods you can do to reduce the trigger pull mechanically.

[Wrath144]

I'm starting to think the same way fps =/= range, rof =/= trigger response. Usually it means a highER rate of fire, but I don't think my M4's humble 22 RPS really shows what it can do in semi. The first shot cycle time is the same between my frankentorque at 22 RPS and my old A1 at 34 rps. Rather, if it is different, it is not noticeably so. It can still put out shots as fast as you can pull the Chimera-shortened trigger (2mm pull), even if you hold it away from yourself and paintballstyle fingerfuck the trigger.
That's all without mentioning my near stock Bolt B4 SOPMOD with its own frankentorque. That gun is closer to 14 RPS, with more than adequate trigger response.
Oh, and they both draw under 20 amps, closer to 14 and 16 respectively.

Also, just sign up for the "Notify Me" on the BTC website. They actually DO notify you, that's how I got mine. You just have to be quick, I bought mine from my phone within 20 minutes of receiving the email. It also helps to follow retailers like Brill Armory on Facebook, or whoever else carries BTC. (Airsoft Store)

[pestobanana]

While FPS =/= range and RoF =/= trigger response, there is still a strong correlation. Precocking is the only game changer. Since you're using a chimera, if all you care about is trigger response then dump in a FT and use precocking.

I prefer to build guns in the 35 ish RPS range and use overspin without AB to precock. Siegetek gears are not necessary for slow builds around 22 RPS. They're only necessary when you start exceeding 500 FPS or reaching 50 RPS. Hell I have a gun that is capable of 44 RPS at 400 FPS and its using SHS gears.

I have signed up for the "Notify Me" thing on BTC. I have never gotten a restock email from BTC or Brill. That's not to say I have never been able to get one, I know my way around getting them. I've had 7 BTC FETs pass through my hands, but I also know how hard each of those 7 were to get.

[Intelligence_Dream]

I was pretty set in using 10:1 gears as my thought was that would give me the best trigger response. I'm not apposed to using an external battery pack if I'm going this route. Would I notice a difference with 13/12:1 vs 10:1, really if I'm going to start making compromises then id like to use a setup that let's me use an internal battery stored in a crane stock.

[ThunderCactus]

you're talking about milliseconds of delay time. Honestly you'll see a bigger difference going from a 12mm trigger pull to a 2mm trigger pull than you would going from 26:1 gears to 10:1 gears.
Because ptw's use 24.5:1 and 26.4:1 gears.

[Intelligence_Dream]

OK so taking what everyone has said into account I'm likely going to step down to 13:1 gears with an appropriate motor either jg blue or shs ht whichever would be more efficient. What would I need as far a a battery my only criteria would be that its an 11.1. Also Thunder cactus you mentioned there were mods you can do to shorten the trigger pull care to elaborate?

[pestobanana]

Originally Posted by Intelligence_Dream

OK so taking what everyone has said into account I'm likely going to step down to 13:1 gears with an appropriate motor either jg blue or shs ht whichever would be more efficient. What would I need as far a a battery my only criteria would be that its an 11.1. Also Thunder cactus you mentioned there were mods you can do to shorten the trigger pull care to elaborate?

Get a turnigy nanotech 11.1 1200 or 1300 mAh 25-50C. I use those to power my guns and they fit in buffer tubes.

With 12:1 or 13:1 you'll be fine with a 16 TPA motor. 22 TPA is overkill as long as you have a proper battery.

There is a way to mechanically shorten the trigger pull, but that involves modding the trigger post, trigger contacts, trigger sled, the actual trigger etc... Easiest way to shorten the trigger pull is if you have a BTC FET and shim the trigger, unfortunately those are extremely hard to get a hold of.

[ThunderCactus]

Highly recommend against trying the mechanical mod, too much to go wrong

[pestobanana]

Originally Posted by ThunderCactus

Highly recommend against trying the mechanical mod, too much to go wrong

It's a very simple concept if you're mechanically minded, but extremely time consuming and requires a lot of patience and precision. If you can't figure out how to do it by looking at the mechanical trigger and you need someone to guide you through it, this mod is not for you.

[Intelligence_Dream]

So I found a battery that fits in my stock that I believe will be acceptable for even the 10:1 gears
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...Lipo_Pack.html
Its 130 amp constant and 260 burst output would that work?

My final build would be that battery
13:1 gears
and the most efficient torque motor I can find for this setup.

Is there anything I would need be it parts or mod wise that might not be common sense?