JG G36, Complete gun rewire, need some basic info

[theguy]

So, after shimming my mechbox last night, and re-assembling it all, I noticed that one of the wires had lost its hold on my mechbox contact. I guess its expectied of a cheap chineese clone. Anyways, after a re-sodder, I noticed several other weak looking points on the gun, and decided that a rewiring was in order.

Although i have done basic electrical work before, i have never done any AEG wiring before, im pretty confident, but i have a few quick questions before i start.

1. I have heard that the best wiring to use for any AEG work is 16 guage, is this true?

2. I have heard that i should always use deans connectors for everything, Is this true? should i rewire my existing battery to use a deans connector?

3. Should I replace any of the trigger contacts while im at it?

Thanks,

-Ben

[m102404]

It's not hard...just follow the existing wiring layout. 16AWG might be really tight with the grip/motor cage.

If the switch was worn as well....it'd really just be easier to get a new pre-wired switch assembly.

Tys

[lemegacool]

since you are doing a nice new wiring id say go for dean... you wont regret it. converted all my guns, batteries, charger to dean and i love it! also you could think about adding a mosfet to your gun since you are playing in the wiring...

[prepaidpwnage]

Yeah, some clones aren't wired well. Its like the lottery except you don't want to win...


This page will be loads of help to you as far as connectors goes.http://www.airsoftcanada.com/showthread.php?t=26918

The gist if the article is that you should solder where ever you can and use deans connectors on anything you will me changing often.

Look at your trigger contacts. Do they look burned out? Unless you have been using a higher voltage than an 8.4v mini, the odds of your contacts being bad is pretty rare.

I think i got it all right, but if I am wrong please correct me so that we can both learn.

Best of luck, I hear its a pain to close the jg mech boxes.

[theguy]

Thanks for your advice guys, im planning on starting this saturday, but before i do, a few more questions that came to me.

1. I hear people talk about removing the fuse all together, Should i do this? why? doesnt this put my motor at risk?

2. Tys, you think 16 AWG might be too tight? what would you recomend?

3. Is there a differance between deans connectors and Deans ultra-conectors.

Again, thanks for dealing with my bombardment of noob questions.

-Ben

[Thenooblord]

And whats the advantage of deans?

[theguy]

correct me if im wrong, but i belive that deans have cleaner connections with much less resitance.

[m102404]

It's in the diameter of the wire and its sheilding...some wires have thin stuff and others have really thick sheilding.

Some wires are floppy and flexible...others are so stiff they're unsuable.

18AWG is usually ok...but again, can't speak to the sheilding without seeing/trying it.

Best of luck,

Tys

[ILLusion]

1)
16 gauge is an okay size... not necessarily "the best", but it does offer good conductivity for its price. It may be a tight fit in some setups though, so be careful. I've seen some gearboxes short out wires that had stacked 16 gauge wiring, causing the battery to fry. It was a combination of a thick core combined with thick insulation.

Standard Canadian Tire / The Source / Wal-Mart 16-ga wiring is okay and cheap... but be careful if the insulation is too thick. It may cause you more headaches than it's worth. 18 gauge is better when you're dealing with the cheap stuff or for leads going through tight areas. If you know you have plenty of room, this thick stuff is fine.
You can also get some ultra high quality airsoft specific 18 gauge silicone lined wiring that is suppose to provide lower resistance for high current dumps in a very small (and thinly insulated) package that should fit pretty much any airsoft application you'd need it in. But again, cost isn't cheap at around $5 per foot.

For 90% of all airsoft applications, you would be perfectly fine with regular 18 gauge wiring. It's easier to install, too - especially when running it through some pistol grips.

Stick with 18 gauge multi-stranded wire and you should be okay. DON'T get solid wire... that stuff is too stiff.

2)
You don't HAVE to use Dean's connectors. Again, same thinig as the expensive wiring, it allows for current dumps with reduced impedance, but it's not mandatory. If someone told you it was absolutely required, then every single AEG manufacturer out there (even Systema) has failed miserably. It's just another chi-chi item to put in that may (or may not) improve performance marginally at best.

One of the biggest benefits of it is the very small and compact size, which is great for many applications in the RC and airsoft world. It offers very high current transfer in a small package due to the large flat and thick contacts having a very positive interface.

3)
There's no need to replace the trigger contacts unless the connection is spotty or you have heavy arcing or corrosion on it - especially if it already has a hole burned through it. That generally won't happen unless you're pulling an extremely heavy spring with an undertorqued motor.

4)
Remove the fuse AT YOUR OWN RISK. It allows for more room (if needed), and may also reduce impedance by a VERY MARGINAL amount at best. If you have the space, you're safer to just keep it in there as it's not actually doing any harm. Only remove it if you are very very aware of what your gun is doing at all times!
You'll get those guys who continue to mash on the trigger when the gun is making ungodly sounds or just not turning over at all, hoping that the problem will fix itself - these guys are the ones who should have AT LEAST one fuse in their gun! Two just to be safe! lol. These are probably the same guys who try to continue playing ball after they just broke their leg, hoping that it's just a charlie horse that will work itself out. It doesn't work that way! lol.
As long as you STOP closing the circuit the moment you sense a problem, or even better yet, know how to disconnect the battery very quickly if need be, then it's not an issue. If you know absolutely nothing about electronics or are not confident in your electrical skills, you're probably better off keeping the fuse in there.

5)
Regarding "Deans connectors" versus "Deans Ultra Connectors"... it's a weird question. You're asking what the difference is between a Honda and a Honda Civic.

Deans makes plugs. They have two types: Deans "Ultra" Plug and Deans "Micro" Plug. The "Micro" plug is not familiar in airsoft and it looks like this:



The "Ultra" is commonly recognized in airsoft and should be familiar to you if you've seen them before:



The "Ultra" is the most popular Deans plug, so as a result, it's almost always just referred to as a "Deans connector" or "Deans plug". When you hear someone refer to a Deans, they're referring specifically to that plug, which is also called a "T-Type connector" by many replicators. Deans is the original designer and manufacturer of the product, but due to the price and sometimes lack of availability, there are many "fakes" or "replicas" on the market. They are not manufactured as nicely and use inferior materials, but ultimately, do the job pretty well considering the much cheaper price of the replica. I'd still opt for the authentic product if I can get my hands on it.

BE CAREFUL, though - many distributors still label the replicas as a "Deans plug" when it is not an authentic product by W.S. Deans Co. They are simply referring to the product TYPE / SHAPE. This is an extremely prevalant practice on ebay - even the colouration of the product looks almost the same as the real thing.

The biggest tell tale sign of it being a fake is the packaging, followed by its source of origin followed by price.
It should come in a fairly large plastic baggie (relative to the size of the product) that has Deans labeling on it as well as a schematic diagram indicating which terminal is "the standard" for positive and which one is negative. It will also indicate which end connects to the battery and which end goes to the device. DON'T mix the male/female plug up, otherwise you risk turning your battery in to a potential thermobaric grenade! (especially if it's lipo). All it takes is for you to place an incorrectly wired battery beside a metal object and next thing you know, your house or car is burning down because it shorted out and it went up in flames!
If it's coming out of Asia (mostly Hong Kong), then 99% of the time, it's a fake.
If you're not paying at least $5USD for the plug (I've seen them for as much as $14 in Canada), then chances are, it's not a real W.S. Deans product.

Some replica companies are obviously imitation, such as the G&P version which has a black body rather than red. These black plastic bodies melt much faster than the red nylon bodies that Deans uses, and the contacts of the G&P version are not gold. Once the plastic body heats up, it can deform and the terminal contacts may not be as precise and secure as they should be, which negates the effect of the T-type plug. Replica plugs also do not hold as tightly as the W.S. Deans product. The real Deans product can sometimes be very difficult to pull apart because the contacts are pressed so tightly together by the embedded springs.


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PS: Please don't take any offense to the comments I've made - they were aimed at a general audience and make no assumption towards your personal skill. At most, I'm assuming EVERYBODY is stupid.

[theguy]

Wow illusion, that you so much, you really cleared up the whole situation for me.

As to the deans vs. Deans ultra thing, i have just heard both terms tossed around, and i wanted to make sure i knew what people were talking about.

Again, thanks, if i have any more questions once i start, ill post them here.

[theguy]

Alrighty,

Update!

After spending the morning driving around Guelph, i was totally unable to find anywhere that sold deans connectors. Most stores had never heard of them. One RC store had the immitation"T-plugs" that Illusion warned about, but no where could i find deans!

Does anyone know of a store in Guelph/Kitchener-Waterloo that might sell them?
Or a good place to buy them online?

Thanks

[lemegacool]

i have a shitload of these "fake deans" and seriously i dont think why they are that bad ,i mean, if the small shitty tamiya plug in your gun is doing the job then putting these "fake deans" cannot do anything worse... no? even when soldering them you have to over heat them ALOT to melt them. if you are not running a crazy lipo-m150-no fuse setup then go for the clone deans, i use it in every gun i have and it performs wonderfully! just to be clear these are what i'm talking about http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/s...idProduct=2116

[theguy]

hmm, maybe i will just use those, After reading that wall of text illsion was so nice to write me, i was sorta sold on Deans or bust.

[ILLusion]

Ya, to be honest, I use the fake ones as well. Granted, if the real thing were easier to find, I'd probably get more of them... especially if they were cheaper. A hobby shop by my place sells them for $14 each plus tax. If you really want them, I can pick some up for you, but I'd recommend trying to find them for cheaper elsewhere first.

The fake ones are fine to use, as long as they're not G&P ones. Just make sure you use a very hot soldering iron to quickly solder the connections on. Keep the iron on for too long and the housing can easily melt on the replicas, which would cause the contact to be crooked. You want a very flat and solid connection.

[theguy]

Fake ones it is!

14 bucks a pair does seem a little ridiculas, esspecially when i need 4 or 5 pairs.